God Speaks the Language of Music - Andrew Greer's Journey AlongTheWay 08

So music gives us suddenly a language suddenly, we're not so different. You know, and and we're from different parts of the country, maybe from different parts of the world. Maybe we look totally different. Maybe we're from different lifestyles, whatever. And the music just breaks it all down. You know, it gets us down to the heart of the matter. But I think that was what music did for me that said, I want to do that.

Welcome to along the way. I'm John Matarazzo, your host and fellow traveler. Thank you for joining me along my way as I try to become more like Jesus every day. I love what I have the opportunity to talk with fascinating people and learn how God has met them along their way. I believe that everyone has a story and we can all learn from each other's journeys. Through my work as a television producer, I get to interact with some of the most amazing people making an incredible impact for God's kingdom. And this episode of along the way, my journey connects me with dove Award nominated singer and songwriter and Andrew Greer. He's also one of the co host of the hit TV show dinner conversations with Mark Lowery and Andrew Greer, turning the light on one question at a time, which can be seen on amazon prime and on Cornerstone network.

Before we get to the interview with Andrew Greer, I wanted to announce the winner of the giveaway from my last episode with Amanda Brooker. She recommended the book love leads by Dr. Steve green. So I offered a copy to someone who would email me at John along the way at gmail. com. Josh from Dexter, Michigan, emailed me and wrote a very nice review of this show. He said, the brilliance of this show is how it reminds us that we are not home yet. Life is a journey and God is with us along our way. Thank you, john, for the quality guests and your tremendous interviewing skills. I truly value the wisdom that is imparted and you converse with your guest. Josh, thank you for your very kind words. I will be sending you a copy of the book love leads by Dr. Steve green very soon. And I will do my best to continue sharing quality along the way moments with you all. Stay tuned because at the end of this episode with Andrew Greer, I will be sharing how you can win a signed copy of Andrews latest DVD project. As we get into the interview now I want to give you a short sample of a song that Andrew performed on the most recent time he was on my TV show real life. Here's a part of his song. I've been searching

just trying to piece together these battles

gotta stop.

Jesus.

Jesus walk the
way

I'm here with Andrew Greer. The Andrew Greer OV that is but yeah, yeah, happy to be here. Thank you, Andrew and I have been I've been friends for a little while now. So it's your many trips to Cornerstone television

yeah here in Pittsburgh it's kind of was my anchor you know I have family now in Pittsburgh i don't know if i forgot about that. Yeah, cousins cousin who's a research research doctor at up but so have other reasons to be here now. But Originally, it was just you guys. And yeah, we became friends from the first time.

Yeah, definitely. Well, I'm, I'm grateful that you're going be able to be on my podcast way. And because I know a lot about your music journey and the different projects that you've worked on. And we've talked a little bit about your, about your life so far. But I like to talk about people's journeys. Because as we go through life, and we look back, sometimes we just see where Jesus intersected us intersected our path, and changed our trajectory. And so that's why I'm calling this podcast along the way, based off of the road to Emmaus conversation, and how the disciples didn't know that it was Jesus that was with him. But he was with him the whole time and explaining the scriptures to them. And it was only after he revealed himself to them that they said, didn't our hearts burn within us along the way as he was revealing the scriptures to us? And so, in saying all that, Andrew, I want to hear your journey of some of your story. And some of those moments where God has met you and changed your course.

Well, I mean, you know, some of that I don't even know yet. Right. You know, some is happening now. And I will discover in hindsight, and some I'm not sure if, if I'll know. And I think that's true for all of us until we're completely in communion with God and, and as we were created to be, and those things will begin to make sense. But for sure, there's been some, a couple intersections that are hard to that are hard to miss. Now, looking back, and, you know, I think my story I grew up in Texas, definitely grew up in church, you know, parents were very involved in church life. And that was a part of our community. Our church was the congregation, many of those became close friends of ours. But I didn't grow up with parents who were like teetotallers, or fundamentalist, you know, in that kind of negative sense of being real critical of people and you using religion to be critical. Or I remember telling, remember experiencing one time, someone disciplining their kids in a way that was like, What do you think God would want you to treat your brother that way? And I remember thinking to myself, my mother never blamed God, like she disciplined. She said, I don't want you treating your brother. You know. And so that was helpful, because it allowed me to, and I think my brothers as well, to experience God, individually, personally, to have to discover him, you know, where would that experience like to allow my life to have those personal intersections that they wouldn't be dictated which they cannot be dictated anyway by other people. But a lot of times we try to dictate, I think it comes from love and concern for someone, we want them to have the experience we've had with God, or we want to make sure they're going to be okay, forever. And that's really out of our hands and out of our control. So I had really awesome parents, and that regard so that I could have my own spiritual experience. And, you know, you know, this very well, music was the first experience I really had with God, it's the first time I discovered like a language to talk with him, or maybe hear from him to it opened up a dialogue, okay, right to communicate. And I don't remember prayer being that I don't remember scripture being that I don't remember sermons being, I don't remember Sunday school being there, or remember music being that. And there was really something when I pressed my fingers into those keys, you know, on the piano, which is where I first learned music that just released some sort of, it was a channel, you know, it says, If when those hammers, you know, in the piano, plucked those strings, there was a resonance that went so deep inside of me, I knew it had to be the Spirit of God speaking, you know, and, and so I've never really had a doubt about that existence of a Creator God, because it's been so personal. There's so many intangibles that became tangible through music. And then, you know, even salvation experience, like so many, especially in the Baptist world, I grew up in Southern Baptists world, Texas, right. So it was always like, fear that you really didn't get saved, you know, you went to church camp, I was like, are you sure you're saved? Well, I don't know. I better go down. So I was always, gosh, John, you don't get to choose it. It's so mysterious to me a while I think, obedience, like we have this opportunity to love God and love others. I don't know how that's a really mysterious process to me about how God is finding and interacting with us because I don't know how I could have ever gotten away from God, you know what I mean? So there, the intersection of music and all that, but and I had a really strong, I would say, spiritual journey through my growing up years in Texas under my parents household, just, you know, all the way through junior high and high school, I loved reading scripture, I, I didn't have a lot of significant details in my teen life of nk store rebellion or behavior, trouble, anything like that. But when I got to college, especially as I got into later college, so this is, you know, coming up on 2021.

I realized that I had some I had a sneaking suspicion, even High School more than a sneaking suspicion that

that I really had some strong addictions. And that began to play out more. towards my senior year of high school, I was very good codependent on my relationships, and not just dating relationships, friendship, relationships to I found a lot of my identity in how much people liked me, there was a lot of reliance on how I might be perceived. And I don't think that was all disingenuous, you know, I think I loved people, and I really didn't want to please them and, and wanted them to be good around me to be okay, you know, like I wanted to, I think there's some hospitality and you're talking about the Instagram, I'm too, so I'm the helper. I mean, I want people to feel safe. But as a result, also began to manipulate and control those relationships to some degree.

So you were the one that controlling those?

Yeah, I mean, was I really I don't know, about, you know, like, as much control as we have. But yeah, I was trying to get something out, like I had such deep insatiable needs, emotionally in some ways. And I also just didn't know where it came from. Because it took work for me to understand more of what the background was that because I grew up, I feel like with a really intact self esteem, I mean, I had hurt feelings from people. And, you know, the times when I was younger, that might have been teased about something that may have pinged me, but as a sanctuary in our home growing up, and I had friends and, you know, was fairly, quote unquote, popular, whatever, like, I was accepted by most of my peers and really loved my growing up experience, then got to college and was like, Whoa, why am I so? Well, I couldn't even identify what it was like a need and stuff. And then from an addictive standpoint, I knew probably even as a late teen, that I was struggling with sex addiction. And so you mix codependency into that, and it can make for a real like, toxic kind of cocktail. And so I was having to like, face it head on, by the time I was 2122. And I remember this leads to an intersection with God. Probably one of the most poignant ones I've ever experienced. And they've only shared with some really close friends actually, I don't even know if I shared this with my parents, but

the

I have very, very close friend, his name is Ben. And he lives now with his family in Minnesota, but we were close friends in college at Belmont University. That's how I got to Tennessee Nashville. And he's a beautiful person and and cellist and songwriter, and just, he's from Minnesota, I did not understand him at first I didn't understand what he was saying. Number one, how he said things but then to you. He was just a really maybe that was an intersection of God to some degree. He taught me how to slow down my brain and how to how to tune up to my heart, how to be quiet. And how did like he really made me an introvert. And I think I may have made him an extrovert.

So really,

yeah, we gotta swap places but he just taught me about solitude. I did not realize until I came into friendship with him that I was not okay being alone. Chris I'm still struggling through all that right codependent my relationships. I'm sure I was even codependent on my friendship, Ben at some point. But anyway, we became roommates towards the end of an A house off campus towards the end of my college career. And then a couple years after I got to college, and he was still in college. And so we kind of knew each other schedules the roommates there were a few of us in the house and I worked at this my first job in industry was with Michael W. Smith and rocket town records that kind of a joint little thing there. And so I was when I graduated college with a music degree but I had interest in music business and industry stuff. I suddenly was working you know in that world and but I was worked two or three nights a week at a little coffee shop called JJ is in downtown Nashville. That's no longer there just got shut down a historic, very sad kind of advice shop that like they sold imported chocolates and you know, all this kind of stuff. Anyway, really cool place, but it would be open till midnight, it was on the like near Vanderbilt campus and a lot of students would come study and so you'd get these close up about 1am really after washing dishes and whatever. And I'd work there two or three times a week at night after

working from Michael rock down and

I can't even I don't even totally know what was kind of took over that night. But I remember when I got off from Jay Jay's. I was going to go one of my friends just lost her grandmother. And I kind of wanted a card or something just to say, you know, something? So I went around tonight. Kroger's, because they're the only thing open that late right to look for a card and some in but John, I can't even explain it hours past. And I was just driving around town and it felt like a drunken stupor. If I hadn't had a drop alcohol, you know, I mean, there was something from my compulsive kind of addict brain that was driving me in it, and I just can't even explain it. So I'm not going to try to here's what I know is that I ended up at a Kroger was closer to the house where we lived. And this was back in the day of kind of flip phone cell phones. And I would leave it You didn't take it everywhere you went, you know, always have in your pocket. I gotta leave it in the car. And I really wasn't paying attention to it. It was silence or something I get back into the car after that going into I don't know how many teeth Kroger's is to look for a sympathy card. I don't know what I'm doing. And I get back into the car. And there's like 1516 1718, missed phone calls from Ben. It's like 3am in the morning right now. And it kind of like when I all I know is when I flipped up that phone and saw his name there. And all those missed calls. It's kind of like shocked me out of whatever this dark, I can explain it as like a darkness. I felt as if I felt very heavy, very oppressed, but I am being driven by a force outside of myself. And I don't know that still to this day, to what end? I don't know what was going on. All I know is it kind of broke at that point in time. When I saw his Miss calls, I called him back he was still awake. And he said, Where are you? You know, what are you doing? And I said, I don't really know what I'm doing. But here's where I'm at. And he said stay there. So okay, so he came down, I just stood outside my car in the parking lot. And his middle night, he came down there. And he said, What time did you begin driving around and I told them and he said, You know I was in your room, because in my room, there's kind of a communal like TV area thing. And when I wasn't there, they would watch it. And he said, I thought of in this was not like Ben Ben was not very good at details, or he didn't know my schedule backwards and forwards. And he said he got finished watching some TV and realize what time it was. And then I was at home and thought that was strange and felt compelled to call me and just make sure I was okay and call me call me again. Again, again, he was on the verge of climate police. And he said he comes from a very Pentecostal background. And he said, The Spirit of God began to move in to pray and pray in tongues, over the safety of my life. And we tracked all these things, time that he was praying, what I was experiencing, all this kind of stuff, just the the connectivity of the timeline. I know it sounds very unprofessional. And the way I'm explaining it, because I can't even fully express the detail because I don't know all the details are on it was I've never experienced the care. And I've got like the idea that God's knows, he sees and he cares, never experienced it in such a palpable way, as I had in that moment. And I think it gave me gave me some, like a bit of a foundation to believe that God is not lofty that he's personal. And so there was a transition that began to happen from God, being seen God as my father, to really beginning to understand him as my friend. And that, that I was safe and safe doesn't mean I'll be alive forever in this skin, or that I won't have a dying experience, because I think I will you know, before I enter into the other side, but anyway, it was a profound experience that can't fully you know, even communicate,

but it seems like the God revealed Himself to you in those in those details, the way that all those things kind of lined up. And you know, as you as you and Ben were comparing notes, and seeing where God was intersecting, I'm almost seeing this played out in like a movie just like, you know, like a split screen. And he's things.

That's what it felt like, I felt like this kind of matrix or something, you know, that was like, Whoa, this was actually like, and I remember talked to my mom, who's a very, very spiritual person, but very practical interfaith, I would say, but, you know, kind of up every morning reading, praying, but again, never like, held that over our heads got over our heads. And I remember kind of not relaying that experience with being like, about the spiritual realm. And she said, will you have of course, the spiritual realm is real. And I don't know you when you're younger, you kind of think of it as this fantastical thing that's probably a little bit impractical. You're

starting for some Star Wars.

Yes. Right. Except I hate Star Wars. But I know, right? Yeah, we're the interview over. So. But I remember if my mom is practical woman in general, and then a practical woman of faith, at least that's how I saw it, believing in the supernatural, and I just do, I just think there's a lot at play. And if I can be present to that more, I don't think I have some special glimpse into that world. But if just to be present, and knowing that there really is this kind of tension, you know, with this life that we're in currently, or the context of life or in currently, okay, there's a tension between my experience here and as I was created to be, you know, like, I think

that's what drives us to want to be more like Christ, God has an original design for us, that we're not achieving that because we're in this fallen state. And it's, it's that hole, it's that God shaped hole that I've heard people, you know, I forget who was originally the one that coined that phrase, but it's so true, that there's something that's pulling us to be more like, there's something that pulls us to accept that weren't our needs Jesus,

there's a longing for sure. And there are so many ways to there's so many surface ways to try to meet that longing, you know, I mean, I've, I have rehearsed many of those ways, you know? And

so, yes, I think,

you know, how do we meet Jesus? How does he feel that, you know, that space within us out? That's, that's hard, you know, some people want to know exactly how that works. They want to know the mechanics of it. And it's not a mechanical thing. You know, what I mean? Like, I mean, there's the, the steps of, you know, you can even let's go to like sinners prayer. I've been having a kind of reckon with that over the past several years, because, well, one, that's not a biblical thing, necessarily. I mean, I think what it says is biblical the surrendering Our lives are Jesus. But it's not the point of salvation. You know, like, I don't know how Jesus is be, like, how he is taking the scales of our eyes so that we are able to experience his friendship. You know, I real? I don't know how that.

I don't know.

I wish I knew. I know. I mean, we know in part because we see it. Yeah, right. Right. I, you know, I, I want to know more about that. I mean, I know me to the just, I mean for I don't I don't have like a specific. I mean, I do have like a day I don't remember that that specific day was shared. It was like it's like a season in my life. I was like four years old. And I heard somebody that was a professional roller roller derby. athlete share her testimony at my church. Later that night, I wanted to pray into Jesus into my heart. I, I don't know anything about religion. If

we can incorporate Jesus in a roller derby everyone will be absolutely,

absolutely. But like for me, that that moment where I knew that Jesus became my Lord and Savior, even before I said a word, it was the decision in my heart, that even as a four year old, that I knew that Jesus is going to be the forgiveness of my past. And even that was only for at the time, there wasn't too much that I

yeah.

You were vile yet.

Yeah. But, you know, later on, when I was 15, is when I really gave my life to the Lord, like the I surrendered my will in my life for the Lord. And so, I think, yeah, those those sinners prayers are a good thing. And it's a step forward, good step forward. But where is it that we actually, in my church, we use the term cross the bridge?

Yeah, it kind of the rubber meets the road. Right? And, I mean, I was six, you know, and so I have memory of the kind of like you have, where the country really first began internally, you know, and, and, and I did walk down the aisle, and I got baptized with a really close friend who now professes to be an atheist. And I don't know why, who's still a close friend, I, I can't explain to you, john, why his life and circumstances would move him in that direction. And mine would move me closer and closer to God, I have seen so many people with some parallel journeys to mines, parallel addictions, or struggles, or, you know, childhood trauma, like my whatever, that that some reason distances them from God, and mine has really moved me towards God, it continues to move me towards God, even in the, in the light depth of my depravity is some kind of compelling towards God, you know, and, and I don't know that they're not being compelled towards God, either. It just looks right now you're This way, you know,

what's our, that's our response to, we are held accountable our response, God's drawing everybody, and he's providing an opportunity, but we can either respond and go towards him, or go a different direction.

So do you think we can go?

Do you think we can respond, even in the midst of some of our darkest? Like, I say dark, but however you want to define that behavior or struggles and challenges and tensions?

Do I think that we can respond towards God? Yes, absolutely. Yeah, I think God leaves the 99 to go after the right. And that's not going to be, you know, some that one is oftentimes not pictured in there just walking in and a nice red Oh, no, that one is in the valley, the valley, you know, saying? There's, there's something coming after it. Like, there's a reason that, you know, we're kind of drawn to that image of Christ coming after us

that way. I mean, I'm drawn to that picture of Jesus, because

it really is the friendship of Jesus also, that that man of sorrows, griefs patient friend picture, you know, because it says that he's not unaware, that he's actually aware, and even in his awareness, he is, like, compelled towards us, you know, that that's friendship, to be desirous of someone, even when they're not desiring themselves, you know, like not treating themselves well, not unhealthy, always healthy states. And I have a, I wouldn't call them acquaintance, a college friend. But we have not kept up and in years, but I have, one of my very closest friends is one of his closest friends. So there's a deep, you know, a quick connection, who lost his life just on Thursday, so last week, and is, you know, 35, whatever is a peer of mine, and

a long

struggle with,

you know, drug and alcohol abuse. And in my friend, and I were talking about it some, you know, you're trying to make sense of these things. And there's no doubt there's a tragedy that associated with that, partly the youth in his age, and then partly just the tragedy of, of where addiction can lead. But I am, I don't know, why we each struggle with what we struggle with. I know. And I've read some of his he was a songwriter, and read some of his lyrics. And, and like, he was convinced, by the graciousness of Jesus, you know, I know that my mind is that they would be defined as a Christian with all this, like, the demons in his life, you know, and sometimes just, I think we don't all, like some get more than their fair share. Yeah. And I don't think that's like, God thrown that on them. I don't quite know how that all works out. Maybe it's genetics and earth? And that'll definitely be a question that I asked

God, when I get to heaven,

right, like, it just was too much of too much. And I think that's was true in his life. And I almost sense a bit of mercy. In his exit, you know, being able to like, not be tortured, is alive, but all that to say I, some, we were still in a culture, spiritually speaking, that might say, he didn't surrender his life to God. Because because of all these things, that were still plaguing him, that some people who would know all the things that still plaguing me would go, we're not surrendered to God, I'm like, you're right. In that area, you're right. But at the same time, you're, you're, you're like, right, or you're accurate. But you know, it's more accurate, is that I sing every morning, you know, all to Jesus, I surrender all to him, I freely give, that is more accurate in my life, like that has the trump card. And so I think it's important to communicate that, you know, as people of belief, like to, in the midst of every of it all, they can still be a really great pursuit of God, and really pointed intersections with God, you know,

I, what you're just talking about here, it kind of makes me think about how, you know, once we think we have it all together, we realized that we're full of pride, and we don't have enough. Melody. Yeah, yeah. And so we know whenever, you know, there's like, we were just saying that there's certain people that would say, because you're struggling with this, you're not you're not fully surrendered. It's a continual surrendering, that we do a daily surrender. And so am I closer to being to being like Jesus today than I was yesterday? I think so. I hope so. I hope so. Yeah. I'm praying. That's the case. And am I surrendering more today than I was yesterday? I hope so. That's my goal. That's my intentions. Do I still fail? Absolutely. Yeah. Am I there yet? No. Yeah. And if I ever think, you know, I'm good enough, then you're not?

Yeah. And I don't attain worthiness, I'm qualified to be worthy. Through Jesus, He is my qualification. And I will continually, you know, press myself into that qualification. Because the fact is, at the end of the day, I just cannot attain it. And I will not pretend that I can attain it. That's good. You know, even in in seasons of greater health, and seasons of better decisions and seasons of moving past some things I struggle with in the, in my history. You know, even in moving forward, I'm not moving in my attainment of anything. Maybe I'm just more relaxing into my qualification through Geez, I like that. You know what I mean? Yeah, it's, which is the surrender card? Like, I'm actually just laying back more on him, rather than trying to chase something else? I don't know. You know?

Yeah, that's, that's great, baby. I mean, that's really that's really some good stuff to think about. Andrew, I do have some other questions that are there. We got through like, maybe one question. I'm enjoying us very, very much. So. So do you remember the first thing that God spoke to you? The first thing that you heard God, say, and how did that change you?

I don't,

I would have to go back to music. Music always felt like God speaking. So maybe I do remember, but I just felt so safe. In the sanctuary of music, and in the, at the panel, I just felt so safe. And I didn't grow up with a lot of unsafe D, you know, I was in not an unsafe environments. My home, again, was a really solid environment. But there was like a deeper safety, you know, we don't know all that we're going to be insecure about and all the ways that we're going to act out based on that stuff. And in our future when we're kids. And I was a kid learning to play the piano. But we do have this kind of innate sense of insecurity, a fear, it's just part of it. You know, like, I don't know what I was fearful of yet, but I had some sense of like, you're being afraid or definitely being insecure. Definitely a feeling of like, I'm not enough.

You know,

I've always had that feeling. And maybe that's part of my personality. And the Instagram thing is like the helpers, try to achieve love by doing something for you, you know. So that would definitely be a response to not feeling like enough. And in fact, I think that's supposed to be the positive message, I'm supposed to repeat to myself as you're enough for something like that as a two. But that's a really hard message for me to receive. But you know, I felt like in with music, not because I was achieving anything. This was when I was alone with music, not performing, not writing, not doing a recital not accompanying a musical, whatever. I just felt enough. So maybe that was God's first, you know, first time his voice was kind of palpable or heard sure to me, because that's definitely a profound message of the gospel is that you're, you're enough, you know, like, You're, you're done as is like, you're good.

Yeah, I, sometimes I feel like music is a way that God wraps his arms around. Whenever we're in that place of worship, in that quiet moment, in that stillness of our long worship time with God.

For sure, music is.

And it is for so many people, even no matter their belief system. That's why I think it really is one of God's primary languages, maybe his language, I don't know, maybe he doesn't speak maybe he sings, you know, like, it is so universal. And it's so deeply profound and known to be profound. And people feel I mean, we relate to huge moments of our lives through music through a song that was played or through, you know, we remember things based on music, people who have dementia, remember all their songs, but they can't remember their kids names. You know, like, That's amazing. That means, like, somewhere in there, there's like, it's tuning up something in us that is, from way before we remember, you know.

So I want to talk a little bit about your, your purpose now and kind of your calling, I guess, in life. So you fell in love with music early? How did you end up going from having it being a hobby, something that you enjoy doing to something that you do it professionally, now,

a ton of work.

But what made you decide, like, I really want to do this, oh, I think this is what God's calling me to do. I think that's what I want to do with my life.

Well, it was what came most natural. And I think that's how we understand some of our calling. It's where I felt safe is it's where we understand some of our calling. I think I saw others participating in music, I saw audiences, participant music, I saw congregations participate in music, saw the way music can move people the way it could unite people, the way it could help us experience things that express things we're trying to express, but we don't know how to like with words alone, and all that I grew up going to concerts, I mean, just loving the live experience of music. So even watching other people, but I remember this. So maybe Music is my calling. But I think people are my calling, in the sense of I always loved the way people I love the way musicians when there was an artist or whatever, connected with people through the art form of music, I always saw that as like, not the end game, because that sounds, you know, makes people a thing but, but that was really the motivation, you know, I saw that with some of my favorite artists growing up is that they really spent time with people they loved on people. And they made themselves available to people, even some really huge celebrity artists, you know, kind of thing. And I love that I thought so music gives us suddenly a language, suddenly, we're not so different. You know, and we're from different parts of the country, maybe from different parts of the world, maybe we look totally different. Maybe we're from different lifestyles, whatever. And the music just breaks it all down. You know, it gets us down to the heart of the matter. So I think that was what music did for me that said, want to do that I was was hacking music helped me communicate to maybe yes, a large group of people so that we can all communicate together more easily.

That's pretty cool.

Yeah, I think that's still true. You know, like, music has been an entry point for me into other things into writing, you know, the written word, and then into this kind of hosting and, you know, podcast slash tv world intersecting more with your world. I think that still has everything to do with people. I'm, I mean, someone recent told me you don't have to answer all your Facebook messages. Because it got a little

someone one of them got a little loopy, you know?

It wasn't. Anyway, so, you know, it was like, any, I could just just use better discernment, you know, but,

but it's kind of hard for me because I'm like, but that's the the response is so key for me. So it's the elementary part of why I love what I do. You know,

that's very interesting. You want to help people realize what, what God is showing you. I think I want it feeling with music.

I think what I want people to know, their enough. And I think music helps with that. I think being generous on camera helps with that, you know, I think us showing ourselves true selves. In a more public forum, where that safe you know, we can't share every detail every time. But

humility, you know, true humility

can help others I think, connect with themselves that think if we're connecting with ourselves if we begin to connect with ourselves. I think God's right there. You know what I mean? Like, it's, it can sound kind of new agey, but it's not. It's so intertwined to connect with myself as is to be able to, to open that up to connect with God if I can, like if I can love myself, that's kind of a sign that I'm receiving God's love. You know what I mean? Because God, again, is the qualifier, you know, so if we, for those that I know close to me, who struggle with loving themselves, it's really a struggle to receiving the fact that God loves you as his right.

So Well, David said, I am fearfully and wonderfully made. I know that full Well,

yeah. Full well, like,

Yeah, he's accepting that fact that he is loved by God, and therefore he can look at himself in that proper light.

Yeah. And being able to receive our to accept ourselves through that lens, then lets us accept everyone else through that lens. I don't care what culture we're into this 2019 I believe fully, I can accept everyone. I mean, everyone, I've talked to friends like this, get this Megan little weird, but I've talked to friends about, you know, there's, I have some new language around.

I don't know how to go here, but people who you can edit this later, but people who

child abusers, that's, that's something that hurts us all. I even think it hurts the child abuser, I think we know intuitively, children should be protected and, and don't have choice at a certain age and all that stuff. 100% I can still accept someone we consider the most vile of our population is not more vile than me. From a spiritual perspective, the consequence of the behavior, maybe more traumatic, and I get it, I get it, you know what I'm saying? Like, I don't think there's anything acceptable about the behavior. But I, I truly believe I can accept that person. Now I haven't been tested. I've been I've been put to the fire of like, my child. And me, you know, being abused by someone and like, how do I respond to that? Okay, so this may be a little bit of like, naive hyperbole. Except for I have to live that way. Because it's the way that I continually present myself before God and say, You alone. I just don't hold the gavel. You know what I mean? Like, I don't hold the gavel, I know I can protect people around me from being hurt to the best of my ability, and would want to do that. And there are people who are not healthy. There are times I am not healthy, that you should not necessarily be required to interact with me if I'm not healthy. You know what I mean? Like you can use your own discernment, your good judgment and all that kind of stuff. But it's just saying the worst of the worst like, my favorite verses of Second Timothy is says in here is a trustworthy saying it reminds me of the David thing for Well, here's a trustworthy saying that deserves full acceptance, Christ Jesus came into the world to save sinners of whom I am the very worst, but for that very reason, I was shown mercy so that in me the worst of sinners, Christ, Jesus might display his unlimited patience and his example, to those who will call on his name and believe now to the king. Okay, so all that, and then we take it back now to the king eternal, immortal, invisible to the only God, not me, the only God, the honor and glory forever. To me, that's the mean. It's Paul saying it but I'm saying it, the worst of sinners, like, it's not I don't think that's some kind of shame card. I think that's me recognizing me for who I am, you know? And turning it back to who makes me different or makes me Yeah, as I was designed originally, you know, without sin. Wow.

You know, the original creation?

I don't know, it's, it's really hard for our culture, I mean, to love people.

Yeah, it is, it's unconditionally. This is this is something that I've been thinking and I, I kind of have this conviction in my heart that the biggest issues that we have in society with with other people, is, it all boils down to the fact that we don't believe that we are who God says we are. And we don't believe that we are who God says we are, then order in order for us to feel better about ourselves, then we need to put other people down. But, you know, we need to be better than them somehow. So, you know, this is a comparison thing. But when you do believe that we are God, we are who God says we are, then you can believe that, that other people are who God says that they are. Yes. And God is steams value and Steve's worth in them. And therefore, you can lift each other up as, as opposed to putting each other down.

Yeah, the deflection Yeah. Then somehow will oppress someone else, you know, the deflection of me, believing am who God says. And it gets, you can say, it's all idealism. I get this realistic. There's real life out here, you know, and, and, and there is a point to grieve our harms towards one another. It is not to dismiss, oh, well, that person is made in God's image. And as a at, it was designed good. But they've done a really terrible thing, a very offensive thing. That is, we should not dismiss our grief over that art that breaks our hearts. But you know why that breaks our hearts because we know that's not how we were designed to be. I actually think the heartbroken is rather than the judgment of someone who's harmed someone really bad. But the heart broken this over it is actually saying, like, at our core, we're grieving because it's not how we were created. It's, it's like I had I'm going to go somewhere else. When the that shooting happened, it's got to be a couple years now. And that gay club and Florida Pulse nightclub, okay. Yes, in Florida. And how many? Was it 50 people or something that were killed? Point Blank shot point blank, okay. One that that takes a very defiant spirit to go in somewhere and shoot anybody point blank. I mean, that's something going on wrong, you know, I get that. And so I was in neatly hurt by that just like, Ah, that's people's lives and a senseless tragedy. I was talking to a friend about it. And they kind of said, nonchalantly, well, nothing happens good after midnight. like kind of like, we shouldn't be out after midnight anyway. And I'm thinking, like, maybe like 50 people, or whatever the number was too many just died at the hands of a person or two. For note for we don't really understand what reason you can say it's about their lifestyle choice and says, There is no reason. So. And your response to that is, well, nothing good happens at human that that's not human. That's not a human response. And that's not someone, at least in that moment of their life, who has received, who God says who they are. Because if you've received that right, then I have to say those lives are completely valuable.

And accepted, you know, like, and so that is an unacceptable act, because it's opposing life.

I don't know if that's completely random, but it's it just reminded me of like, what where we tend to go to is like, we value people based on their behaviors. So in that instance, you could say that for either side, the people being shot where you, you devalue them, because nothing good happens after midnight, they're in a club, and they're of a different lifestyle, or whatever. And then will then the person shooting like, and I just look at it with grief, I just look at with heartbroken this because

it's just all mixed up. You know, it's all to me identity issues as far as

who we really are, and as it were loved, as is no exceptions. So, and to me that act oppose that truth. That's from God. Anyway, so it's easy to hold this. I think it's easier not to reckon with it, and maybe know it, maybe that friend of mine, her grief was actually so deep for that, again, that this is not how it was meant to be that she had to come up to the surface and find some grabber gavel back and just make a quick judgment call so she could move ahead in her life. And I get sometimes that's what we have to do. Because the fact is, we have no control. You know, like, that's heartbreaking and of itself,

it's really hard to admit that we don't have control. Well, I mean, yeah, it's the truth. But sometimes it's like, we want to, we want our opinions to be able to fix everything out there. Like you watch the news. And you're like, well, if I was in control, I wouldn't, then yeah,

yeah. Or almost way. So then we also try to make sense of things, because we can't make sense of it, which is also a surrender to I'm not in control. And we try to make sense of it by surface judgments, you know, I'm just going to have to hold my tongue, you know, and I'm going to have to, I just have to, like, issue a prayer, you know, that once again, says, I am not in control. And this is evidence of how on income I am, you know, like, and so I, I lay down again, I surrender, again, I present to you again, and I ask that your light be exhibited not, like pierce the darkness, do it, you know, I just think that's the only posture I can take. Because I just can't, and I just can't judge anybody like, I have. It's the plane thing. And you're I totally because it's like, oh, my gosh, I have a I have like a cement truck driving through my all the time. You know, like, I mean, in, you know, in recovery terms, I've heard people say, you know, like, we have enough to be concerned about for ourselves have to worry about everyone else. And that's like, kind of a way just to say take care of yourself, right? And don't worry about it. What else? Well, yeah, I also care about everyone else. And I care about their plight and their struggle. But it is a way of saying like, there's there's just no room for judgment.

Yeah, we're again, talking about purpose and destiny. What are some practical steps that you took towards achieving that calling in life?

Yeah, I think hard work comes with practicality, right? I mean, first was being trained in a household where is not shunned, or diminished to go after creative fields. And then a belief that you have a brain that can work out the details of that. So you can make ends meet or provide for your family, right with what you're really passionate about. So I think that was the first step that I didn't have a lot of control over. That was my parents and their messaging, that helped motivate me, but I definitely each person has to do it for themselves, right, to some degree.

So I think,

I think not being afraid of hard work, in the sense of hard work that's not totally associated with what you think your purpose or calling is. I think purpose and calling is deeper than our profession on any level. So you can actually be exercising some purpose and calling before you get to the profession you're really looking for. And I do think it's important to work towards your profession, like, do something you love and work towards doing that. Because I think there's something spiritual about that, too. But I mean, I've waited tables at a cafe, you know, and I worked early morning shift at the YMCA, you know, it was practically I got my membership free, and also got some extra cash. I did you know, taught piano lessons, I hated teaching lessons. I love kids, and I just can't say I'm teaching them. So, um, but I did, you know, I was a decent teacher, and it was kind of more affiliated with what I wanted to do. And yeah, I did some things behind the scenes in the industry. And I think it just wasn't afraid of that. And I had a strategy the whole time. It's not that strategy always went just like I said, it wouldn't, but I would look at I need this much money to live, and how can I begin to pare down from the jobs that aren't associated with the profession I want, and begin to replace that income with association to what I wanted? Do That make sense? So so I didn't have to all at once be like, I gotta make my whole living at only the thing I love? Well, no, maybe I'm only making like 10% at first of the off the thing I love, but it's got, but I can build some momentum off that or I can build some relationships off that that will, that will help me facilitate that in the future. And these other things that can just begin to, it felt more practical to like, Okay, I'm going to stop waiting tables as of this date. And let's say I make $400 a month doing that. So I'm going to, I brainstorm and figure out what was associated my career? Well, you know, it's something that seemed like such a big chunk to chew off rather than I need to, I need to make up for $2,000 off this thing that kind of is intangible still $400 Okay, we'll start there. And then it and there's some trust and faith and all that like that we're going to be taken care of, we're going to be provided for also some, like, limiting my expectations, I didn't buy a house until after a lot of my peers. And that was so that I could have some leeway, some lack of liability, financially, that that's that a house will, you know, there's liability with the house, and there's a lot of expense with the house. So I didn't have that I just had a brand, you know, as it can make my rent the rest of Take care, you know, little things like that. But that takes swallowing some pride there definitely some moments where I thought I was behind in life. And because I wasn't doing some Joneses, and things like buying houses by this time, or getting married by this time. And I'm not not saying relationships get in the way of professional at all. But

you know, you just look at everyone else and think

they're doing what they're supposed to do. And now and high, a little a little bit of hindsight, I've got a long way to go. But it's like, oh, yeah, and they're still at that nine to five, I really didn't want Yeah, and now I'm my income is on par with like, where it needs to be to provide for this phase of my life and so on par with them. And it just takes so little time, it seems like a long time to build where you're wanting to go. But if I look 10 years ago, I was releasing my first record, just independently, no distribution, pre selling it myself and, and had a goal to be on the road two weekends a month with a paying gig, even just one night, you know, like that was the goal. And I kept myself to that I'm sure there was a month where I didn't have two weekends or something. But I that was the goal in some months if I had three. And I drove myself around in my exterior with my portable piano and would set up my own stage and even like brought Christmas lights and a couple of candles to make it feel good when it was the most horrible vibes, you know, whatever. And you know, and I look back kind of fondly at some of that stuff now, but it didn't seem so hard, because it was what I needed, it was really hard to I don't know, you know, like, I guess just being glue, swallow your pride, you know, and do the things that are required within a healthy perspective. To move forward, I was listening to a guy who's an ABC executive producer, and has had really great success in that world. And he was talking about that very thing like, don't be afraid to see some opportunities that you can't quite figure out how that aligns perfectly with your end destination, because there is no end destination. And it very well may reveal something you didn't even know about the industry you love that gives you a chance to do that. Or it may just be it make ends meet for now. And it's better than starving. Yeah, yeah, sure. And there's some pride and just providing for yourself, right being able to eat at the end of the day. So anyway, and then celebrating achievements along the way, I, you know, I'm a big non achievement person, like, achievements are not the goal. But I also have been taught more recently by some close friends house celebrate how to stop and say, hey, that's cool. You know, like, when Mark and I, on this show dinner conversations that we do. When amazon prime picked it up, like that's a mainstream major streaming service, picking up a show, we just started, you know, like a year and a half ago. And someone said, Could you stop a second and like, go out to eat with some friends and like splurge a little bit. And it wasn't that I'm wound so tight, I wouldn't do that. I just, I'm a worker, and I move forward. And I don't take things as I kind of set my expectations in a realistic level. So things are, you know, maybe that's my insecurity of failure or something. But anyway, so to celebrate along the way, I think celebration actually is a good motivator to, yeah,

that's something I'm I'm learning as well. I've got some people in my life that are encouraging me to set those goals. And when you reach them, celebrate the pause for a sec, pause for a second and enjoy that. Yes, because we can be so busy that we don't even pay attention to it.

Yeah. And then we're looking to the towards the next quote unquote, achievement or next goal. And that's good to do. But you can at least give yourself a night or day or maybe a weekend away with some friends or, or whatever, relaxing for a full day like a full day of no work and just being like this is because I've worked hard and and look at what's been the fruit of some of that. I do you know, one of my friends Cindy Morgan, who you know, very, very close friend of mine, and she told me a long time ago, she said, Oh, Andrew, we just eat nose for lunch. We just eat nose for lunch, and occasionally get a yes for dessert, you know, but the yeses are like that all anyone else sees and they look at and they're like, Oh, my God, you're doing so well. And they don't know that we've been gobbling up nose for lunch, you know. And it's a little bit of a thick skin idea. You know, I heard someone say recently, like, grow thick skin, but maintain a tender heart. And I think that's a good balance. Like, don't let every criticism throw you on the ground. But also don't get cynical. Yeah, you know,

because it's easy to be cynical.

It's easy to to reach a detour or roadblock in our path. And say I want to quit, I want to give up. I'm not seeing any of these yeses. I keep getting nose, nose nose. How did how did you deal with some of those? Like, how do you how did you keep with rejection with rejection? Like how did you what was what's the most difficult, one of the most difficult steps that you had to take?

Hmm, about most difficult

doesn't have to be the most difficult, but it just a difficult step that you had the opportunity to quit.

I dealt with a lot of peer insecurity, when I first started in music, I've now learned is not very abnormal, no matter what level of success you're at. But I would actually go on Wikipedia and look at people's birth dates and see if I was where they were, by the time they are a certain age, you know, which is like the worst idea ever. It's so comparison minded. And I got out of that habit pretty quick. I mean, I give myself pep talk and confess to some friends and you know, cuz age is not an indicator of anything really, in that regard. It's just the number of trips around the sun. It is it is you know, and some Yeah, it is. And I've lived long enough now, and tied to the music and entertainment industry that it's like, you see people who've already burned out that were really, you know, at a pinnacle when I was comparing and so

you know, I, gosh, you know, I've had tons of no's and tons of

perceived failures.

I'm just on the road of the long and steady in Now, like

I started surveying some lives that people really respect, we've had long careers, and a lot of them are slow and steady was a slow growth. And it was they've had some pinnacles along the way. But they've had as many downs as they've had ups and financial and commercially and all this kind of stuff. So I don't, I don't know, like, I can't remember, like this greatest rock bottom that like propelled me and back into action. But just dealing with comparison has been really important for me to not compare celebration as part of not comparing, actually, because you give yourself a chance to realize your unique place in this world and your unique and the unique response to what you have done. And that that's different than everyone else, you know, just for a moment, even, it's different. And that's cool. That's like a little bit of your mark, you know, and we do have a desire to leave some sort of legacy, for whatever reason. And so there must be something kind of spiritual about that. But yeah, someone encouraged me to also receive failures, information, like, it's just learning, it's learning curves all day long. They never end, you know, learning curves never end. So. I don't know, I kind of like, my kind of like the whole meal. Now. You know, I don't mind eating those nose. Because I think I have enough like, tracker could arise. There's, there's dessert around the corner here, there's a treat. And I'm like, maybe the nose or just kale. You know, like it's like 10 taste that great. But it's, it's good for me.

At least it's good for you.

Exactly. It's given me regular. Yeah.

That's funny. One of my favorite questions that I like asking people is, if you could go back in time to visit to visit a past version of yourself and give yourself some advice. What age would you go back to her? What season of life would you go back to? And what would you tell yourself? And also, would you listen to yourself?

Huh? Yeah, probably not. Right.

Yeah, you know, I've been asked the question like, what would I tell myself from like, a kind of holistic standpoint, but from a professional standpoint, or, you know, that kind of trajectory? I think just to, maybe to be myself, I think I'm still learning what it means to be myself. And maybe that's a lifelong journey. This new foray into journalism and hosting things and being on camera and being behind the camera. And that wasn't a dream of mine. When I was a kid, you know, like, maybe to just be yourself because you realize what dreams are actually your dreams earlier? Does that make sense? Yeah, I think I'm beginning to fulfill some my dreams, that I was either too shy to admit they were my dreams, because I thought they were like pie in the sky, and everyone has pie in the sky. Or I just was a kind of like, for lack of a better phrase I True enough to myself. I mean, I definitely think music was always a part of me. And I kind of always had this inkling that like, I remember back asking questions. The reason I wanted to meet artists that I loved was to ask them questions, it was more than getting a picture, I would get a picture and get an autograph. But I wanted to ask them questions. Well, guess what I do for my living? Now I asked questions. And

now what kind of questions did you want to ask them? Like, because I had the opportunity to meet a lot of Yeah, a lot of interesting people in some celebrities and everything. And I've also been at concerts where people want to ask those people questions, but it's more that. It always it always frustrates me whenever people ask, Well, how do I how do I get a record deal? Yeah, like, that's not really what I want to know from this person. Right? What what kind of questions did

totally I address? I don't remember asking, like, how do I be you? I remember asking, like, kind of what made them tick questions, you know, like, and sometimes that was really to like a song that may be really related to me. And I was curious what was behind that song, but which was a clue into how they tick, you know, or I was curious, kind of what life was like for them. And not so much because they were celebrity but because I really connected with something that they were expressing in their art form. And I want to know, what was behind someone that I connected, so easy to and why were we connected, connected in that way? And it's always been How do people tick, of course, with a dad, that was a counselor? I don't think that's totally I mean, cuz he was always interested in how we taped, okay. And he was asking questions of his own family, more than trying to prescribe things for him. He was really asking questions, he really was very interested in how people work, and what they're thinking, and he really wanted to know our thoughts, even when we didn't know our thoughts, you know, and so I think I probably came by some of that naturally, from him. Without even knowing it, he kind of rubbed off for me that way. So the question thing, you know, and also really always loved kind of the hosting elements thing, like, kind of programming, you know, you get programming like programming something really beautifully. And then also administering that from in front of the camera, our live audience. And even a lot of my music career has been Andrew and friends, a lot of Andrew and fans things, a lot of collaboration. So I just never I don't I never liked being totally alone on stage. And I'm comfortable with it. You know, we taped some stuff where I'm solo today, but

I like people around I like a team. I like a group effort.

feels more natural, I think like, how we were made. You know, I think that's why huge solo artists typically crumble at some point. I just think it's too isolated.

of a spot. And so you intentionally don't want to isolate yourself, you intentionally try to bring people into Andrew and friends concert.

Yeah, I do. I just love collaborate.

I love the synergy of people. I love chemistry with people, you know. But yeah, to some degree, it's for leaving. It's like, Oh, I don't have to carry the whole thing. It's even relieving from the sense of like, Oh, you could have laryngitis and the Indian French show could still happen. You know, I mean, it's like, it's just for leaving. I've I am earlier in my life. And I would say my 20s I just put a lot of pressure on myself a lot of unseen pressure. I don't think people saw as much they mostly see me as relaxed person. I think that's my true nature, but so much pressure. And

somewhere along the line, I just thought you know what,

that's not the way to live. In if I went at this a little less alone, you know, then I want to express I want to have space to express myself. Don't get me wrong. Yeah. I don't want someone to always be to have to chime in to that. But I don't want them nearby.

You know?

I love it. I love like on dinner conversations. When we have guests, some I know some I don't before they hit the door. We always leave I'm walking them out, you know, walking them or them in their manager out and talking about things we weren't talking about before they enter the room. And I couldn't do that on camera by myself. You know, I've been here that's called stand up comedy or something? I don't know. But

yeah, that's

even stand up comics, though. Need an audience? They need to have somebody?

They gotta have that connection. There has to be Yeah, yeah. It's very hard for me to talk to camera alone. Yeah,

I respect the people that can do that. Yes. It's not an easy thing to do. No, it's not. Andrew, what is God teaching you recently? What is God teaching you right now?

Right now, um,

you know, I'm still pressing into this idea of like, being what we're talking about earlier, the qualification thing, which is a worthiness conversation. And I think I don't, I don't want to dictate God's lesson. Like, I want to just try to receive it. So I'm not sure if this is what he's trying to teach me. But it feels very present. And it is a spiritual lesson. And, and that is that I am worthy. That comes, there's a lot in that, you know, believing I'm loved unconditionally, no strings attached, believing that I am accepted and received by my Creator, and therefore I am worthy to be accepted and received by other people. Yeah, I have, I have some fear in my life about around.

I guess maybe everyone has us a little bit, but I don't know, for me.

Even though I it's so funny, because I'm I exist within a community where I'm very known. Like, we know each other, we're transparent about what goes on in our lives and stuff like that. And yet, I still have this fear of

if they knew, you know, and

I could name some of those things, like if they knew a, b, and c, but then there's all these unnamed ones that I don't know. So what am I afraid of, you know, like, I don't even know what I'm afraid of anything. And I think that comes down to an unworthiness thing, I think fear is me not totally surrendered to the idea that God loves me as I am. And that I can live out of that place, rather than trying to get him or someone else to love me. And the thing is, we don't get love, we just, we just see that. So, you know, stop trying to achieve love. And just, again, I think that's a huge spiritual thing. You know, at its core, it's what we've talked about, often on throughout this entire time. It's, it's a spiritual thing. So I feel like he's kind of, I do feel like if God that that's the lesson on his lesson plan for me right now. Which was what I'm sensing then it's like, I feel like he's kind of beaten it. And you know, like, he's really trying to, to get me to absorb it. Because it's present on my mind all the time.

I receiving love.

Yeah, I don't feel like shame is not present on my mind all the time. Or like, that's good, you know, but that trying to understand what it means to surrender to a level to receive that, or, or just doing that, you know, I wake up in the morning, and I've made a habit for years since I took this trip to Wyoming, just wake up in the morning and say, Good morning, God, you know, like, just a kind of a present awareness of, we're walking together that he's present. It's kind of an addition to that right now is like, help me receive your love. Help me live out from your love, you know, and help me not try to use someone else for love today. Because I can just receive it from you, you know, and

it's the love we long for, you know, it's it's it. It's the whole thing. Yeah.

Do you have a verse that you would consider like a life version? I

already said they already said that. That's right. I will repeat it again, if you like that sounds.

Timothy. Yeah. It definitely is alive. First. I didn't learn it till later. I mean, I was in my 20s. But it is and here is a trustworthy saying deserves full acceptance. Christ Jesus came into the world to save sinners of whom I am the very worst. But for that very reason, I was showing mercy so that in me the worst of sinners, Christ, Jesus might display his unlimited patience as an example, to those who call on his name and believe. So now it's the king eternal, immortal, invisible to the only God be honor and glory forever. Amen. That's right.

That's a good one. Thanks for sharing that again. Yeah.

What book do you think would impact my life that something that you've read? Or even that you've written, that you think would really benefit? No,

I don't really recommend my own writings. I'm

a, uh, that's a great question.

I tend to think in recent terms of whatever it you know, but

you know, one of the more spiritually focused things I've read

recently, is Henry now and is the wounded healer.

Henry, now his life with the beloved life of the beloved is the one I just finished reading. And Henry is definitely waxes poetic at times. So it can, you know, you're kind of like, you have to go there artistically. And just read along and let it sink in, not try to dissect every word. But the life of the beloved is all about his book. It's a letter to his closest friend, who's a Jewish man who has asked Henry to write a letter to he and his Jewish friends, or maybe not even Jewish friends, but just kind of non believing friends. About what is it? What is there to the gospel? What does this all mean? And this is really interesting is a letter to him. It is interesting. And the letters in the form now have a book about 60 pages or something, but so he's right, you're reading a letter, he's writing to his friend. And it's all about the fact that we're Beloved. And so maybe that's why i resonated with so much recently, but I think anybody could, and I think, yeah, I don't know if you'd love Henry now his writings or not, but I think the book is interesting, wounded healers really special to have his and that's about Jesus, you know, really identifying with us in our sorrows and griefs and, and healing coming from

me know, kind of the stripes that we bear. The title

was fascinating. The wounded healer, wounded healer. Yeah, but just that's makes me want to read it just by lyst. Yes,

it's been a while since I've read that one. But you might really like that one. And then I have a ton of fiction, I could probably recommend that have nothing to do with anything of great value.

Well, Andrew, how can I find you on social media and your other conversations and stuff like that

easily? Just Google Andrew Greer and fortunately still come up or the website is Andrew dash Greer and that's gr ee r.com two E's. From there you can get linked to my social as my socials are easy because they're all at a Greer music Andrew Greer so at a career music, dinner conversations they can find a link to that to their but that's easy, because it's just dinner dash conversations. com where you can google dinner conversations. The title of the show is dinner conversations with Mark Lowry and Andrew Greer subtitled turning the light on one question at a time. So whatever now search engines are so good. Yeah, you can just do your own little research. And you can find my birthday on Wikipedia. And you can compare if you're doing as well as I'm doing at my age.

You remember your own age?

I know I do. I know. I'm always under estimating or overestimate. It's not a consistent. I'm not always going low.

That was going high. That was funny this morning with you. Yeah. But we determined I'm 36.

That's where I'm at.

Thank you for being on my podcast and just having this conversation with me. Thanks. Andrew is someone that I always look forward to being with because he is so much more than just a musician or a TV host. He is truly a deep person. And I greatly appreciate the conversation that we have. And I look forward to the next time that we get to be together. One of the places that my heart burns during our conversation is when we questioned, are we closer to being like Jesus today than we were yesterday? That question is extremely challenging. Can I lay my head down on my pillow at night and really say that I was a good representative of Jesus today? Some days, yes. Some other days, maybe not so much. This is my prayer, that as I will walk with Jesus, I become more like him. So Jesus helped me walk intentionally with you. When Andrew talked about comparing ourselves to others, that was also very convicting. I appreciate his openness to say that he looked at people's Wikipedia pages and tried to match up with our mile markers. comparison is a dangerous road, it leaves us very unsatisfied and diminishes our faith that God really does have a plan and a destination for us. being truly surrendered is a great way to combat this. Andrew said that he wakes up every morning and sings I surrender all. That is a wonderful and very practical idea. We also talked about celebrating our wins and accomplishments. And that's something that I'm not very good at. So I'm going to ask you for help. As my real life TV season wraps up in late June, I will have produced 1000 episodes my TV show, how should I celebrate? Please send me some ideas. I might actually use one of them. And I would really appreciate your help with the last along the way moment that I want to leave you with is that we don't get love. We just need to receive it. God's love isn't something that we can earn. But he freely gives it to us. And a change life is a proof of God's love. I pray that you feel his love today. As I said in the beginning of this episode, I have another giveaway for you. Andrew offered a signed copy of dinner conversation season one on DVD. That series is a lot of fun. And you get to see Andrew in his element interviewing people such as Michael W. Smith, Sandi Patty, rust, half and many more. For a chance to win this DVD please email John along the way at gmail. com with your name where you're listening from and you are along the way moment from this episode. It doesn't have to be long. I just love hearing how this podcast is blessing you. Thank you for listening to along the way. If you've enjoyed joining me along my way, please rate and subscribe to this podcast and follow us on Facebook, Instagram and at my website along the way dot media. You can also email me at John along the way at gmail. com. I hope that you've enjoyed this part of my journey and may you realize when Jesus is walking with you along your way.