(241) “Around the Throne” with Dean Braxton

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Because I have that image of God in the center and the circular sphere and everything,

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it changed how I look at everything on the planet.

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I would think so.

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And how I react to things on the planet.

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And to know that in that environment there in heaven,

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we all get to see Jesus and the Father all the time.

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We can never not look upon them.

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And that image is with me even here on the planet.

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It's different because of just how the planet is structured,

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but it's the same concept that God is always there.

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He never leaves us nor forsakes us.

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Yes.

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We can always go boldly to the throne of grace.

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God promises in Joel 2, 28 to pour out His Spirit on all humanity.

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Welcome to Global Outpouring.

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Will we contend for that promise outpouring?

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Will we equip for that outpouring so that we may engage in that outpouring?

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I'm Philip Bus.

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And I'm Sharon Bus.

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Welcome to the podcast today.

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We are so excited to have with us again our dear friend, Dean Braxton,

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the man that left his body for an hour and 45 minutes and his body died.

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The medical team was working on him the whole time,

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so it's one of the very best documented situations of a death experience.

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And he was really, really dead for a long time, according to his doctor.

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So he is with us for another episode and we are going to talk about things in heaven

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so that we can begin to understand how on earth as it is in heaven can happen.

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When we get a greater understanding of what's going on in heaven,

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we'll have a greater understanding of how we can worship and live on earth

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in a way that brings the kingdom of God to the earth.

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So today we're going to talk about what it's like around the throne.

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Thank you so much for joining us today.

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You are really going to enjoy this episode.

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And I have an announcement to make.

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And you can go to our website, globaloutpouring.net,

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and make sure that you're on our email list so we can keep in touch with you

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because we have our convention 2025, May 21st through 24th,

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and you are some of the first people to hear this.

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We have two of our speakers confirmed now, Tony Kemp and Dean Braxton.

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And we're so excited to have Dean with us today,

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but he has just given us confirmation that he will be with us for our convention.

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And it's going to be a special, special time.

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He's going to give his testimony.

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Maybe you've already heard his testimony,

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but then we're going to have at least one afternoon session of questions and answers.

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And he told us very clearly that because of what the Lord told Dean

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about how he can teach when he's with us at Global Outpouring,

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he told us that he's going to be able to go into greater depth when he answers questions.

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So if you've been in one of his meetings and he's done a question and answer,

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you might not have gotten everything that you could get.

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So plan to be with us at this convention.

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It's going to be a glory time.

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We're going to have wonderful, glorious worship and deep teaching and intercession.

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This is a gathering of intercessors that, wow, it's just amazing.

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And it's a time for hearing from heaven, getting your marching orders for the next year,

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getting a call to the nations.

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As you pray over the flags, we'll have flags of nations up around the room.

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You know, when you get into a group of people that are believers,

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you bring your anointing and everybody else brings their anointing.

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And there's a synergy that takes place.

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But in order to be a member of Global Outpouring, you must have made a commitment to the Lord and done a 21-day fast for the anointing of God in your life.

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It's not about fasting to become a member.

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It's about fasting for the anointing because that anointing increases when you deny yourself like that for 21 days.

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It's the shortest of the prophet length fasts, like the length that Daniel fasted.

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So this fast, when you get a whole bunch of people together that have done this and increased the anointing in their life,

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well, the synergy that you get in that context is absolutely amazing.

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And so we want to invite you to come, whether you've ever fasted or not, come and get into this atmosphere.

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And you're going to have an opportunity to make relationships, build relationships that will go on for eternity.

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This is going to be an amazing time.

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And we encourage you to go to our website, click on the events tab and look for the Convention 2025 information.

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You can go ahead and make your reservations at the St. Louis Airport Marriott.

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There's a link to it right there.

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And we'll be having more details about the speakers coming up ASAP.

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Well, Dean, it's such a blessing to have you with us again today.

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Well, it's really great to be with you.

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I can't tell you how delighted I am that after your experiences in heaven, when your body died because you left it,

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all of these things that you've experienced and the many things that you have kept quiet about

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because you weren't sure whether people were ready for this.

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I just want to say, I believe it's my understanding that the Lord is leading people to this podcast who are ready.

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Yes.

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And so the Lord has given you permission to open up and teach some things among us.

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And we just say, thank you, Jesus.

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Yes, amen.

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Thank you, thank you, thank you.

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Thank you, Father.

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We want to touch on something that we haven't ever discussed before that has been in my heart.

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I started studying this and teaching it a bit back in the late 90s.

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I don't know how soon before that I started meditating on it.

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But I began to see how that praise in the Hebrew words, it has in it a circular motion.

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And I haven't got all the scriptures for it here at the moment, but I want to talk about this circular motion that I'm seeing.

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For instance, where it says that David danced with all his might.

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Yes.

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That word is the Hebrew word, karar.

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And it means to dance or to hurl, to go or move in a circle.

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It can also mean to exalt or to leap like a lamb.

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Have you ever seen lambs and goats and calves?

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That they do this little leaping, twisting dance.

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It's so cute.

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And there's another word, huel, which means dancing in a circle, around dance.

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And I believe that's the reason why you see Jewish people dancing in a circle.

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Circle dances, yeah.

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Yes, the Bible says to.

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Right.

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You know, it's so clear that it means to dance in a circle, to praise his name in the dance.

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That's machal, praise his name in the dance.

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That's the circle dance.

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And the word huel is to twist or hurl in a circular or spiral manner.

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So talk to us about the things that you saw in heaven that have to do with circles and spirals and spheres.

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And just whatever the Lord is giving you liberty to share with us.

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You know, Sharon, you know, I always go back and let everyone know that I'm evangelist.

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And my major goal is to go out and get people to know Jesus Christ as Lord and Savior.

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Yes.

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And most of the time it's to make sure people understand Jesus' love for them,

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that he died on the cross for them so that they can be with him and the Father through the Holy Spirit forever.

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So I want to bring that up first, you know.

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Yes.

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In a way, and maybe we'll end with that too, because there's some circular within that, if you think about it.

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OK, come on.

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Those three in one, the best visual that I could say is it's like a circle.

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Each one was like a circle and part of the circle of, you know, what we would call the godly head.

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But the reality of it is it's a circle.

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Is it a circle or is a sphere?

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You could say it's a sphere in the sense of because it's round, OK, like that.

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But the reality is a circle, you know, it's not one dimensional.

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Let's put it that way.

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OK.

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You know, and it's not three dimensional.

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It's really so many dimensions I can't even demand, can't even describe.

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Yeah.

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OK, but let's go back because I want to, you're talking about the dancing and, you know,

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deep worship in heaven, which I wrote.

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And I talk about that in a way in that book.

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Now, one of the things I wish I would have probably known now that I didn't know then

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is that circular word that you were just talking about in the Hebrew, because in heaven,

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almost everything that I saw was done in a circle, you know, almost everything.

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And worship was really done in a circle.

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When I describe in one of the chapters, the flowers and how they spin around and spin around

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and they were doing the circle, you know, if you think about the angels and the cherubins

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that we talk about in the circle within the circle.

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And I said it looked like a helicopter blades, you know, when they were praising the Lord.

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They weren't helicopter blades, that's the closest I can come to describe,

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but they were in a circle and they were given praise in that atmosphere.

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So there's so many different things in that book that I'm describing, but the picture would be

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they're doing it in a circle, even when we were praising the Lord and the Father around the throne.

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The throne was suspended, right? Up above?

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It was suspended, but the glory came all the way.

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Oh boy, you're asking me to describe something that I have nothing on the planet to even adapt it to right now.

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I'm going through my head and my heart to try to adapt it.

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That one just went well outside of my boundaries of how to explain it on this planet.

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Because there's no end to it, let's put it that way. There's no end to it.

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You know, it says the beginning and the end, the Alpha and the Omega, that's really in a circle format.

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Yes, I've been seeing that.

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You know, most people don't realize it. And when I would say this, remember, I think I told you,

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people would ask me how huge God was, you know what I mean?

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And I would say when I look at the beginning, I lose the end.

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And when I look at the end, I would lose the beginning because it was a circle.

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Yeah.

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You know? So how do you describe that to us that are looking more two-dimensional at the most?

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You know, we know three-dimensional, but most of us look at things from a distance, point A to point B,

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you know, point B to point C or point A to point X, you know, something like that.

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And yet that's not how it is in the kingdom of God and heaven.

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And no one's concerned with the end.

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Yeah.

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And no one's concerned with the beginning.

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Wow.

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So you think about that, you know? But I remember when the angel was calling all of us to come around

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the throne of God, around the throne of God, to give him praise. And it is suspended, okay?

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Heaven was like a sphere, okay?

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Okay.

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And God was in the center, the Father was in the center of the sphere.

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Yeah.

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So there was nowhere in the sphere that you could not see God.

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Beautiful.

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You could not see the Father. It wasn't like He disappeared on you because He was behind a mountain

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or there was a valley you had to go through. Everywhere within the sphere, you could see Him

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because He is the center, because He lights up everything and everything is lit up because of Him,

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you know? And so here it is in heaven and everything's coming around. So you have to

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envision everything coming around, not just in a one-dimensional round the throne.

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Oh.

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Around the throne.

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Oh, oh, I get it. Around in the sphere.

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Around in the sphere. So everything is around the throne because we were called by this angel

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to come and give God, I would say, tell Him how much we love Him. You know, a lot of people will

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say give Him praise, but I would say, tell Him how much we love Him. I wish people could grab that

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word when I say that, that you're not coming around Him just to tell Him how great He is.

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You're coming around Him to tell Him how much you love Him. You know, you may use words that

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say how great He is, but within that, you're telling Him, I love you. That's all you really say.

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Oh, yes.

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But if you think about just how that process of that angel sending out that note A, you will

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feel, you know, understand the note A, and it went out in such a way that when it reached me,

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it circled back for me to come back with it.

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So it wasn't just that it came in me and then that was it. It hit me and then it circled back

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to go back to where it came from. It drew me, but it was more of a circle in its motion. It wasn't

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just a straight line back and forth. It was a circle in its motion to go back there.

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And this is the first time I've shared this with anybody that's listening, you know,

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mainly because you opened up the door for me to start sharing about the circle of the Spirit.

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I've shared about the Spirit before, and like you said earlier, I was concerned with people not

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ready for that because we imagine a heaven similar to earth.

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Yes.

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Okay. And it would be like earth turned inside out.

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And we lived on the inside of earth instead of the outside of the planet that we call the outside.

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Do you understand what I mean?

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You take every building, everything on the surface here and flip it around and have a

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sphere. The earth was a sphere. Now, some people don't believe that they believe it's flat,

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but it is a sphere.

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You saw it.

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Yeah, I saw it.

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Okay.

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And then everything is centered inward and God is the center of everything. And even Him,

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in the sense of, you know, we say sits on the throne and our minds want to go and make him more

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look like a human being. And yet we really look like Him in so many different ways.

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But the reality of it is, if you think about that, like I said, He's not...

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Oh, no way. I tried to find words to even describe what I saw, you know, and I lose...

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I usually don't even try to go here because it gets so complex for me to try to describe that.

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And I think maybe somebody else who saw Him would say it's different. You understand what I mean?

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But all I remember is that His face faced every direction. So you never...

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No one was looking at the back of the head of God, the Father.

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Okay.

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You know, His face faced every direction and someone says,

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oh man, that sounds so weird. And that sounds so out there, but He's God. He's going to be outside

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of our confinements of what He should look like or what He should portray. And I even think to

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the point, and you've heard me say this about Jesus Christ, He will appear as you believe He is,

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you know, right now on the planet. But the Bible says we will see Him as He is.

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Yes.

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And I was outside of my body and I didn't let my flesh define Him when I came back.

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You know, I let the Word of God define Him when I came back. And because I let the Word of God

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define Him, I didn't lose the image of what I saw. Does that make sense to you?

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Absolutely. Yes.

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So that spear is round and it's expanding. It's like a balloon that would have air pushed in it

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and it's moving out. I always tell people, heaven is expanding. And someone says,

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you know, what is it expanding in? I don't know. I won't even try to go there.

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It wasn't a big issue for me when I was there.

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I'm thinking, why would it be a big issue when I'm here on the planet? But it's expanding.

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And as it's expanding, it's not only expanding outward, it's expanding inward.

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You sent me a diagram recently where we started going inward and inward and inward and inward.

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Yeah.

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And every time we went inward, it's almost like we saw a different diagram or a different world.

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Yes.

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Well, that's how heaven is too. It is so... C.S. Lewis said something,

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you know, the writer of The Chronicles of Narnia, some of you know. And in one of the books of me

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and you discussed it before was The Musician and The Nephew. And in that book, there's a place

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where you could enter into different worlds. Okay. But as he described it, listen to how he described

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it, he described them as pools of water. They were circular pools of water.

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Okay.

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The reason I'm saying that is because we say dimensions and I know people want to say that,

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I think that's an earthly term or that's our diagram of things. I call it expansions.

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A lot of times, sometimes we say levels, I always say we're expanding because we were made to go

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into realms in such a way that's different than most people realize it. I think we do it on the

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planet quite often and don't realize we're doing it. Because of just how we think of,

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I didn't go from here to here, that means I didn't enter in. And yet you entered in in a different

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way because our spirits, the real us were created to move in that realm. That's our natural realm.

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So in going back to what C.S. Lewis said, pools of water, and each time you jumped into a pool

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of water, you were in a different realm or a different world. Okay. I really believe that he

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had that experience where he saw that. And now he described it in the book the best way he could.

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Yeah.

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But I really believe he saw it. And that's what I, I never tell people this. Some people say,

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oh, you traveled through heaven, you were an hour and 45 minutes at the most I could have been there.

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But because of the dimensions that you go through or the different realms that you go through,

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you see a lot more than most people think. There were so many different realms in heaven.

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Wow.

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The Bible tells us there are different heavenly realms in Ephesians. I think it's the first chapter

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starting at the third verse, I believe it talks about different realms of heaven. And some of the

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translators say realms, they don't say some of the other words that we say about heaven,

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but they say realms of heaven. And that's what we are created for. And they're all circular.

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Wow. Wow.

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We were created for that. We think in a circular way too. I think we do.

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Yes.

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If you think about it.

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Well, yeah. If you consider that everything about time is circular. You have a calendar

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that goes around and every year you have a January, February, March, et cetera, et cetera.

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And you come back around, you start again. Every month is circular, every week, like the whole

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thing about the moon going around and having it goes around and it has phases and you have a full

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moon, you have a new moon. And every day, every hour, everything's circular. Our whole time

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understanding is circular. And God gives us second chances coming back around again.

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Excuse me for interrupting.

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Oh no, that's okay. I think some of that, you're saying that, I think some of that's been taken

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and used in other religions. If you think about it, that circular thinking.

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Yeah, Hinduism.

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Yeah.

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Hinduism, you know, don't think that way. You got Buddhists that think that way. We got a lot of

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others. It's almost like they were right, but they used it wrong.

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Right. Well, it's also part of the time thing, which is, you've expressed to us before that

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that time is the clicking of the time clock to the end of the devil's reign or whatever you

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would even call it, his existence, whatever. I'm not sure how to call it, but you know,

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that's why he knows his time is short because there is an end point to it.

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Right. There's an end point to it. It's almost like his circle was cut.

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Wow.

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You know what I mean? Even yours and mine, our circle has not been cut.

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People that don't know Jesus Christ as Lord and Savior, their circle has been cut.

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There is an end time for them where there is no end for us at all.

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But let me go back to try to describe that again, the post-sphere, because even me saying right now,

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it's like taking this earth and turning everything inside out. I've never used that term. I've never

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said that before. This is the first time I've been able to take that and really describe it where

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I think people can grasp. If you take every building, every tree, every mountain, and all of

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a sudden flip it and all of a sudden it's the inside and the outside is the outside, and then

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you've got the Father, which is the center of everything because he's holding everything

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together. He holds it all together by his love. That love that he has for everything holds everything

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together in that realm.

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So that's the word of his power.

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That's the word of his power.

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The word of his power is love. Wow.

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That's correct. Everything gets to see him all at the same time. It's not like a line

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and that was one of the things that really there was no line in front of even Jesus.

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It was like there was no number. I used to say it quite often when I came back.

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There was no number two. Everyone was number one.

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You know, sometimes they say you're second in line, third in line. There was none.

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Everybody had and I could see that because of the sphere and because of how we could approach

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the Father and how we could approach Jesus Christ. It wasn't that Jesus Christ just stood in

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the center also. He could roam around the different sides, but everybody knew where he was all the

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time. Wow. Wow.

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It's even like now I believe in our own spirits. We know where Jesus Christ is. You understand

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that? I mean, sometimes we go through some pain and we go through some things and we

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where are you got? But in reality, our spirit always knows where he is. When I got to heaven,

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I didn't have to ask anybody how they get to Jesus. I knew exactly where he was.

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Wow. And that's because of the Holy Spirit on

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the inside of me. Yes.

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Breaking this even down more to the spirit. So you got the Father, he's in the center,

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you have to sphere around. Everything's expanding outward and then also inward,

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everything is expanding. So all of a sudden we got a realm that's really circular and it's

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everything, creation, which you can go inward into these circles and go places or you can go

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outward in these circles and go places. Wow. And we were created for that. And there's no

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end to it. It's sort of like a spiral.

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Just like a spiral. Yeah.

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You know. The spiral keeps going.

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And I think in the dancing that you were talking about the Jewish people, the Hebrew people do,

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which is a circle, it's honoring that creation. It's not only a form of showing appreciation to

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the Father, but it's also a form of honoring the circular creation that God has put us in.

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Now, some of us will have a hard time with this because we got so linear in our thinking.

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Yes. You know what I mean?

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Yes. And some of us right now

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that are listening to the jumping up and down saying, thank you, Jesus. I always thought it

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was like that. Amen.

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Amen. You know, the Hebrews tend to think in circular or spherical thinking and the Greek

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thinking is more linear. And we have so much influence in our Western culture from Greek

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thinking. Well, I think it's also when you think about even family. You know what I mean? And

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family is a circular motion. You know, we were talking about this between me and you earlier

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about your granddaughter and how your granddaughter favors your grandmother. Was it?

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Yeah. Okay. If you think that's a circular.

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Wow. There comes that image around again.

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Yeah. You know, I have a son that favors my dad. You know, you take the picture of my dad

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and I don't look like my dad, like my son looks like my dad.

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Isn't that amazing?

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He does. And so, and saying that to you, if you think about the family is really a circular

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structure. You know what I mean? Yeah, we have two, a husband and a wife, but in reality,

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it's again, it's moving around in a circle because really was what that was produced to create a

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third person. Exactly. Do you think of that?

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Yes, absolutely. I've been thinking along those lines.

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Yeah. And some of us create more than one third person.

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I ran into a lady the other day and told me she's number one out of eight, you know,

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there's eight of them.

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Yeah. I was a fourth of five, pretty good, pretty good size family.

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Yeah. But back in those, you know, in the old days, those eight, nine, 10,

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Yeah.

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I even asked her, I said, were you at home when the youngest one was born? And she said,

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well, my oldest son is older than my youngest.

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Yes. Yes. Your uncle is younger than you. It's kind of weird.

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Yes. But I think if people would look even at the family, it's a circular, when you're in heaven,

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my family came to greet me in. And I remember the connection I had that went all the way back to

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Adam. Okay. You know that connection's there all the way back to Adam. And one of the things that

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got me really about that is that the circle has not been completed and the circle won't be completed

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until the last person is created. If you think about it.

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Sure.

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You know, but God is really connecting us back to that circle, which leads back to him.

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He's the ultimate father.

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Yes.

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And there's no way to not have that connection with him as that area. And so I'm just going

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through my head right now, because even the Trinity is a circular. If you think of it

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as circular, father, son, and Holy Spirit, you know, I've seen it where people make the,

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what do you call it, the curved lines instead of the straight lines, like a triangle.

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Do you understand what I mean?

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Yeah. Yeah. They take three circles and kind of superimpose them over each other a little bit.

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I've seen that, but I also see the connection between the circles. Let's say they're separated,

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like the son's here and the father's here and the Holy Spirit's here. And then they'll

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draw a circle like this to connect them. Okay. And I look at that as they're connected, period.

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I don't look at that as we're connecting them. They are connected, whether we

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think they're connected or not. And they do not separate themselves. And I can see the over,

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you know, putting one on top of the other and you have the circles like that too.

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But the reality of it is they are one because of that. And they're not three in one. They're

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just one period. They don't think of themselves as the three in one like we do. I know that

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theologically doesn't go with somebody, but somebody else to try to define it. And everybody

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else ran around with it and thought, this sounded good. But when you get there, you find out,

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number one, no one really cares. You know, he's God, period. You understand what I mean?

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But number two, you just find out that that was not the correct thing. And it's hard for some

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of us that want to be intellectual, you know, to figure out that we really cannot define God.

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Yeah. Our finite minds, the problem is our minds are finite.

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Yeah. I think our minds are finite to a certain extent. I think if we let go,

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you got people that are just trying to be spiritual without Jesus Christ. And because of that,

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they have, I say, not the ultimate anchor. They help them know the truth of what it is to really

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walk in the Spirit of God. So they're trying to be spiritual. Does that make sense to you?

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Yeah.

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And they still let a lot of their carnality get in the way of their movement in Christ.

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Okay. When I was in heaven, none of that was with me anymore. So I didn't have to battle

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through the carnality or my thinking of what it is. And a lot of the things that I thought would be

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very significant for me were not significant when I got there. What was significant is,

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when I saw the Father and the Son and the Holy Spirit, well, the Holy Spirit really was in me,

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they were all connected. You know how I said, we will be in Him, in Him, in us? That's circular.

397
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Absolutely.

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If you think about it. That's a circle too. And it's a continual circle. When I talk about,

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I looked into His eyes, I'm talking about Jesus, and I saw the love for me. I was the only one He

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loved. And then I say, in every moment, He's creating new love for me. That's a circular.

401
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It's getting more and more intense. Here's another one. When you get to heaven, you're going to look

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good. And the next moment, you're going to, I hate to use the word better. I changed it to,

403
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just recently, you're going to be more glorified. Because we're moving from glory to glory to glory.

404
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Yes.

405
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You understand what I mean?

406
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It's all more so.

407
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And so it's all circular in its way. And someone said, well, that means you're going to come all

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the way back to the beginning. No, because it's what you said early. It's more of a spiral.

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And it keeps getting bigger.

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Wow.

411
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Remember how, well, you weren't there, so you don't remember this.

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I'm talking to you like, hey, I'm talking to you like, you've been there, you've seen it too,

413
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you know all this stuff.

414
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I've got it through your books anyway. It's in my imagination.

415
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Well, you also got it in the Holy Spirit. But when I talk about the flowers praising God,

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and they were in the spin mode, you know what I mean? And there were more of that spinning,

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I almost say like a tornado. And they were moving around like that. And so that is the best way I

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could describe the whole process that I saw going on there. The circle spirals, the circle

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spiral was greater and greater every moment. And it will never end. We have no concept of it not

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ending. I'm on a circular journey right now.

421
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Yeah, I guess that makes sense. You're going back.

422
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Going back. That's right. I'm on my way back. I'm on the circular journey. When you and Phil

423
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just recently went out and did the things you did throughout the United States, you know,

424
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throughout the United States, you made a circular journey.

425
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True.

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To come back to where you're at.

427
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True.

428
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You know, we do that more often than most people realize. Now I would ask Sharon and Phil this

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question of you two, why would people need to know this?

430
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Well, for me, I want everything that we are studying, everything that we are learning to

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make an impact on us. And if it makes an impact on us and brings us closer to Jesus and brings

432
00:33:20,560 --> 00:33:26,320
us deeper into relationship with him, I figure if it works for us, it would work for others.

433
00:33:26,320 --> 00:33:27,360
That's very good.

434
00:33:27,360 --> 00:33:28,000
Yeah.

435
00:33:28,000 --> 00:33:32,960
Yeah. And when you're talking about the circle, even when I was when I was real young

436
00:33:33,600 --> 00:33:41,440
and I was thinking about eternity, thinking it's forever, forever, forever, and ever,

437
00:33:41,440 --> 00:33:47,040
and it used to kind of freak me out. And sometimes it's and sometimes it still does.

438
00:33:47,600 --> 00:33:52,880
We're never going to die. We're never going to, you know, it's a very unique feeling.

439
00:33:52,880 --> 00:33:53,840
World without end.

440
00:33:53,840 --> 00:33:55,040
World without end.

441
00:33:55,040 --> 00:33:56,480
Remember we used to sing that in church.

442
00:33:56,480 --> 00:33:58,800
World without end. Amen.

443
00:33:58,800 --> 00:33:59,360
Yeah.

444
00:33:59,360 --> 00:33:59,600
Yeah.

445
00:34:00,960 --> 00:34:06,560
I think it's best illustrated for us on the planet by looking at mathematics,

446
00:34:07,440 --> 00:34:10,400
because and I'm not I'm not a lover of mathematics.

447
00:34:10,400 --> 00:34:13,200
No, I've I've I've loved math. I remember.

448
00:34:15,200 --> 00:34:23,280
But but I think the the best way to express it on the planet is you have like a number line.

449
00:34:23,280 --> 00:34:32,160
Okay. So it's it's linear, sort of. But if you I don't even know what part of math study that

450
00:34:32,160 --> 00:34:40,000
this is in, but you have like a linear number line that goes infinitely in one direction as

451
00:34:40,000 --> 00:34:44,400
positive numbers and infinitely in the other direction as negative numbers.

452
00:34:44,400 --> 00:34:51,360
And then they have another plane that goes like up and down that is also negative and positive

453
00:34:51,360 --> 00:34:58,480
that that goes. So you if you expand on that in your mind, you could maybe imagine that there's

454
00:34:58,480 --> 00:35:05,040
more planes with more lines going each direction negative and positive so that so that you could

455
00:35:05,040 --> 00:35:12,320
build that sphere in numbers. And that that that diagram you were talking about that I sent to you

456
00:35:12,320 --> 00:35:17,600
will put a link to it in the show notes. It's the Mandelbrot set. And there was a Jewish

457
00:35:17,600 --> 00:35:26,160
mathematician, I want to say in the late 70s, that had this this understanding that there is some kind

458
00:35:26,160 --> 00:35:33,520
of set of numbers that if you plot all those numbers, that it will make a shape. And he was

459
00:35:33,520 --> 00:35:41,440
working with the early computers and developed this theory, he plotted it on the computer and

460
00:35:41,440 --> 00:35:47,920
printed it out. And it made this kind of odd shape of sort of a circle on top of a circle on

461
00:35:47,920 --> 00:35:54,480
with another circle on top, you know, interesting three circles. And it tends to be mostly in the

462
00:35:54,480 --> 00:36:02,160
negative numbers. And as computers have developed, people got the idea, let's also plot the numbers

463
00:36:02,160 --> 00:36:09,040
that are close to those numbers and give them a color. And so every different distance from

464
00:36:09,040 --> 00:36:15,520
the Mandelbrot set is plotted with a separate color. And it's amazing to see as the thing that

465
00:36:15,520 --> 00:36:20,800
we sent you, it's amazing to see how as the computer goes deeper and deeper and deeper and

466
00:36:20,800 --> 00:36:27,440
deeper and deeper into the negative numbers, that it is creating these beautiful spiral and

467
00:36:27,440 --> 00:36:32,880
pictures of like, there's one section that looks like a like a group of elephants walking together,

468
00:36:32,880 --> 00:36:36,640
you know, where the right where the one the trunk of the one grabs the tail of the one in front,

469
00:36:36,640 --> 00:36:43,440
you know, and there's, there's, there's all these different shapes that come out of this idea of

470
00:36:44,320 --> 00:36:49,680
these numbers going one direction. And that's what you said, it appeared to be going inward.

471
00:36:50,400 --> 00:36:54,720
So I'm sure that there must be some kind of set of numbers that'll do the same thing going

472
00:36:54,720 --> 00:37:00,640
outward. I don't, and maybe it just hasn't been discovered yet. But I think it's a good illustration

473
00:37:00,640 --> 00:37:07,040
on the planet to understand that you've got infinity going both directions inward and outward.

474
00:37:07,040 --> 00:37:07,840
Okay.

475
00:37:07,840 --> 00:37:13,200
Well, the reason I asked that question, because I usually when I'm sharing like this, I'm always

476
00:37:13,200 --> 00:37:20,480
wanting to add to somebody, and especially in the sense of helping them to walk on the planet to be

477
00:37:20,480 --> 00:37:26,640
able to serve God better in what they're doing. And so, and asking that question, I just wanted

478
00:37:26,640 --> 00:37:32,160
to make sure this information is good and is exciting. But I want to make sure that it asks

479
00:37:32,160 --> 00:37:40,960
to us and we grow with it. Now for me, because I have that image of God in the center, and this

480
00:37:40,960 --> 00:37:46,480
circular sphere and everything, it changed how I look at everything on the planet,

481
00:37:46,480 --> 00:37:47,520
I would think that

482
00:37:47,520 --> 00:37:55,760
I would think so. And how I react to things on the planet. And to know that in that environment

483
00:37:55,760 --> 00:38:02,480
there in heaven, we all get to see Jesus and the Father all the time. We can never not look upon

484
00:38:02,480 --> 00:38:10,880
them. And that image is with me even here on the planet. It's different because of just how

485
00:38:10,880 --> 00:38:18,400
the planet is structured, but it's the same concept that God is always there. He never leaves us no

486
00:38:18,400 --> 00:38:24,000
forsaketh. We can always go boldly to the throne of grace. You know what I mean? There's so many

487
00:38:24,000 --> 00:38:29,920
things that, and if you think about the image I have in my head, I have nothing to stop me from

488
00:38:29,920 --> 00:38:34,560
accessing Him. People always talk about portals and you've heard of people talk about portals.

489
00:38:34,560 --> 00:38:39,520
This is a portal. Well, where is it going? It's going to the Father. You understand what I mean?

490
00:38:39,520 --> 00:38:43,440
You understand what I mean? We can say it's going to the heaven, but it's really going to the Father.

491
00:38:45,360 --> 00:38:50,960
We talked about the lights, the crowd, remember? On Jesus' head and how that was coming out and

492
00:38:50,960 --> 00:38:57,440
coming to everybody. All that is going back to them. Okay. And so I say that to you because

493
00:38:57,440 --> 00:39:03,680
in talking about this circular, I'm hoping it expands people's thinking so that they

494
00:39:03,680 --> 00:39:10,480
can better serve Christ on the planet. This is one of the scriptures the Lord told me to bring up,

495
00:39:11,200 --> 00:39:17,120
to even relate to this. And it's Nehemiah 9.6. I use it quite often when I'm sharing

496
00:39:17,120 --> 00:39:20,640
because I want people to know everything that God creates is alive.

497
00:39:20,640 --> 00:39:31,520
Amen. Nothing He creates is dead. So every motion, every circle, every sphere is alive.

498
00:39:34,080 --> 00:39:36,800
See law. Let's stop and think about that.

499
00:39:39,280 --> 00:39:47,040
Like the will within the will, you understand? Those are beings. And this may go outside of

500
00:39:47,040 --> 00:39:54,080
some people's boxes big time. Sometimes when people are ministering, they see spheres.

501
00:39:54,960 --> 00:40:00,880
You know what I mean? Different angels of spheres. I remember one time in Idaho there,

502
00:40:00,880 --> 00:40:04,880
one of the greatest outpourings we had, I think I may have shared this before.

503
00:40:05,840 --> 00:40:12,000
I used to call what I call deep worship in heaven, consuming fire worship in the old days.

504
00:40:12,000 --> 00:40:17,760
And we did a teaching on that in the church there in Coeur d'Alene. And the Lord showed up

505
00:40:17,760 --> 00:40:22,240
and powerful and it was really, and I lost it. I don't know if I've shared this with you before,

506
00:40:22,240 --> 00:40:27,520
but I lost it. And the reason I lost it because I didn't think we could get to that intensity

507
00:40:27,520 --> 00:40:32,960
of praise and worship on the planet that I experienced in heaven. And when I saw the

508
00:40:32,960 --> 00:40:39,600
intensity of the praise and worship that we got there, I didn't want to come out of it.

509
00:40:39,600 --> 00:40:44,880
It was like, I'm in the bubble now, as I would say. And I didn't want to come out,

510
00:40:44,880 --> 00:40:49,360
to be honest with you. I wanted to stay there. And this was in the early days of the ministry,

511
00:40:49,360 --> 00:40:55,280
maybe three or four years within the traveling around. I think one of the most amazing things

512
00:40:55,280 --> 00:41:04,000
that we saw is when I'm expressing this to people of that worship in heaven, and we had

513
00:41:04,000 --> 00:41:10,560
people there that we could ask Connor to play certain parts. So I would say to someone,

514
00:41:10,560 --> 00:41:16,160
that angel that rose up and started calling everybody in, and there was someone that had

515
00:41:16,160 --> 00:41:21,360
a violin. And I think I told you that violin, that A on the violin was the closest I can come

516
00:41:21,360 --> 00:41:27,520
to that sound that I heard in that realm of heaven. And when they played it, as they were playing it,

517
00:41:28,160 --> 00:41:32,960
the men in the audience went down on their hands and knees, but they just didn't go down

518
00:41:32,960 --> 00:41:38,640
on their hands and knees softly. They bang, bang, bang. They dropped where you could hear them

519
00:41:38,640 --> 00:41:44,800
hitting their knees on the floor, like someone dropping a box or a heavy stone or something on

520
00:41:44,800 --> 00:41:51,920
the floor. And it was going all over the place. And so, in saying that to you, I believe we were

521
00:41:51,920 --> 00:41:57,120
in that atmosphere. Most people don't realize when they're asking for the atmosphere of heaven,

522
00:41:57,120 --> 00:42:03,360
they show up, it's really a spear. It's really a spear that you're going into that spear because

523
00:42:03,360 --> 00:42:09,520
that's what we were created to be in. So in saying that to you, I lost it because I did not want to

524
00:42:09,520 --> 00:42:20,160
come out of that spear. And the pastor wanted me to explain the spears that were showing up all over

525
00:42:20,160 --> 00:42:25,680
the place. Okay. Were they showing up on photographs too? They were showing up all over the place.

526
00:42:25,680 --> 00:42:30,800
It's like these little circles. Yeah. We've seen some of those kind of pictures.

527
00:42:30,800 --> 00:42:37,280
Yeah. And those are beings. Those are beings that God's created. And I know some people out there,

528
00:42:37,280 --> 00:42:42,240
well, what do you mean? They're angels. They're messages of God. They have a message. And so,

529
00:42:42,800 --> 00:42:46,240
some of us need to stop and listen to the message that they're giving us.

530
00:42:46,240 --> 00:42:47,200
Amen.

531
00:42:47,200 --> 00:42:54,480
But to go on, what I'm saying is that I lost it in that moment and God had to remind me,

532
00:42:54,480 --> 00:42:58,560
I needed to stop and get back to doing what he wanted me to do, which was to share

533
00:42:58,560 --> 00:43:02,080
him with the people there because I didn't want to at the time. I just wanted to go away.

534
00:43:07,440 --> 00:43:12,960
The way he said it to me was unique. I remember I'm crying like a baby because I did not think we

535
00:43:12,960 --> 00:43:18,000
could ever do that on the planet. And I'm crying like a baby. I'm bawling like, thank you, Jesus.

536
00:43:18,000 --> 00:43:22,960
Thank you. I didn't think you could do this. And I remember having a mic as I'm on the floor and

537
00:43:22,960 --> 00:43:27,760
it's right there. So, they're hearing me and I didn't care who heard me. And I'm just thanking

538
00:43:27,760 --> 00:43:32,960
him for what's going on in the place. And I hear him say, suck it up, son. We got work to do.

539
00:43:32,960 --> 00:43:37,760
That's hilarious.

540
00:43:37,760 --> 00:43:45,360
I had to get up, suck it up, get off the floor. But I had to explain the spheres that they were

541
00:43:45,360 --> 00:43:50,320
seeing all over the place because we had seen them. It was like a conference I did from

542
00:43:50,320 --> 00:43:55,600
Wednesday through Sunday. And they were all over the place and God was using them to minister to

543
00:43:55,600 --> 00:44:00,560
people and things like that. But this is what I want to say in this Nehemiah 9, 6.

544
00:44:01,120 --> 00:44:06,480
You alone are the Lord. You made the heavens even the highest heavens, along with all their

545
00:44:06,480 --> 00:44:13,520
multitudes of stars, the earth and all that is on it, the seas and all that is in them. You impart

546
00:44:13,520 --> 00:44:20,720
life to them all and then the multitudes of heaven worship you. That life that we have within us is

547
00:44:20,720 --> 00:44:29,200
to worship the Lord. And it's our natural breathing like we do of air on the planet. It's what's been

548
00:44:29,200 --> 00:44:36,240
putting us to worship Him. That's what the life is all about. And the worship isn't just singing or

549
00:44:36,240 --> 00:44:44,720
any of that. The worship is doing His will. And by us doing His will, I see it as a circular motion.

550
00:44:47,360 --> 00:44:51,360
He gives us something to do. We do it and we return it back to Him.

551
00:44:54,000 --> 00:45:00,080
And that's the worship that we do. One of the reasons maybe why He said obedience is better

552
00:45:00,080 --> 00:45:08,720
than sacrifice. Because the completion of that circle is very important to God. So I think in

553
00:45:08,720 --> 00:45:14,240
a lot of what I'm saying here is as we're giving this out, and it's just coming to me as I'm talking,

554
00:45:14,800 --> 00:45:22,640
God is wanting to have us to complete that circle. And that is by doing His will on this planet and

555
00:45:22,640 --> 00:45:29,200
what He tells us to do. There's a trust that goes into that. You know how He's always saying,

556
00:45:29,200 --> 00:45:34,880
trust, you guys know what I'm saying completely. But I really believe it's a circle motion and

557
00:45:34,880 --> 00:45:40,640
that's worship, if you think about it. That whole worship. Because I came to understand

558
00:45:41,440 --> 00:45:47,360
in heaven, worship is doing the will of the Father. It's doing His will. You can say doing

559
00:45:47,360 --> 00:45:54,720
the will of Jesus, but Jesus literally is getting His will from the Father. And He's portraying that

560
00:45:54,720 --> 00:46:02,400
to us on the planet. Everything comes through Him to us because of what He did. And He died on that

561
00:46:02,400 --> 00:46:10,240
cross in such a way so that we have the opportunity to be a part of that continual circle now that God

562
00:46:10,240 --> 00:46:15,760
has created. Is that good news or is that good news? That is really, really good news. You know,

563
00:46:15,760 --> 00:46:26,080
I get deep in meditation about how our Father is the Father of lights. And how in the Gospel of

564
00:46:26,080 --> 00:46:33,360
John chapter 1, it talks about, you know, in the beginning was the Word and the Word was with God

565
00:46:33,360 --> 00:46:41,280
and the Word was God and the Word became flesh and dwelt among us. And verse 4 says, in Him was life

566
00:46:41,280 --> 00:46:49,920
and the life was the light of men. And the Greek word there for light is phos, which means unkindled

567
00:46:49,920 --> 00:46:58,080
light. It's like it's life light. And, you know, thinking about how they've discovered doing in

568
00:46:58,080 --> 00:47:06,400
vitro fertilization of eggs, they see under the microscope this blast of light that takes place

569
00:47:06,400 --> 00:47:14,720
in that moment of conception and the light, Jesus said, I'm the light of the world. And then He

570
00:47:14,720 --> 00:47:21,840
turned around and said to the disciples, you are the light of the world. And our job is to be that

571
00:47:21,840 --> 00:47:28,160
obedient child. I think one of the reasons why it just came to me as you were saying this, to obey

572
00:47:28,160 --> 00:47:35,600
is better than sacrifice. Sacrifice has to do with repairing something that's broken. And if you obey

573
00:47:35,600 --> 00:47:41,760
from the get-go, there's nothing broken that has to be repaired. So that's why obedience is better

574
00:47:41,760 --> 00:47:47,840
than sacrifice because you don't need sacrifice when you're obeying. Jesus paid the sacrifice and

575
00:47:47,840 --> 00:47:55,600
our acceptance of that and just getting into that life light and light life, there's something so

576
00:47:56,560 --> 00:48:04,400
expansive. You know, I remember when we were doing the praise and worship part of the services

577
00:48:04,400 --> 00:48:09,600
at our Methodist church here, you know, they have the acolytes that come and light the candle.

578
00:48:09,600 --> 00:48:15,840
So we were standing up near the candle and sometimes I would just be, I don't like to use

579
00:48:15,840 --> 00:48:22,720
the word mesmerized, but it's kind of like I was taken by this light and you could see the flame,

580
00:48:23,280 --> 00:48:32,320
but there was a global glow around it, a spherical glow around that flame. So it's like the light

581
00:48:32,320 --> 00:48:35,360
comes out of the flame and creates a sphere around it.

582
00:48:35,360 --> 00:48:36,000
Wow.

583
00:48:36,000 --> 00:48:43,760
You know, that's where I think we get, we call our halos from. You know, if you look at the halo,

584
00:48:43,760 --> 00:48:48,800
the circle, especially when you look at the Catholics and they put that halo around Jesus

585
00:48:48,800 --> 00:48:55,840
Christ, you know what I mean? I remember being in heaven and seeing that halo around Jesus Christ,

586
00:48:55,840 --> 00:49:01,120
you know, what amazed me was just not the halo over there, it was going out too. You could defined

587
00:49:01,120 --> 00:49:07,440
it, but it was still moving out. You understand what I'm talking about? It was really interesting.

588
00:49:07,440 --> 00:49:12,960
It had the circular shape to it, but it was also moving outside the circle.

589
00:49:12,960 --> 00:49:13,680
Wow.

590
00:49:13,680 --> 00:49:19,200
But the thing that got me also is the different changes. I think I told you this before,

591
00:49:19,200 --> 00:49:25,760
how he changed every moment he looked different. I really believe that the halo was going out

592
00:49:25,760 --> 00:49:37,440
in a circular manner, every form he looked like at that moment.

593
00:49:39,200 --> 00:49:43,520
And I know that maybe I'm saying this because I know some people maybe they deem,

594
00:49:43,520 --> 00:49:49,680
but I just knew that I was looking at him and he looked different every moment.

595
00:49:49,680 --> 00:49:56,720
And I don't usually get into it that deeply because of how we, that's like Akeana that did

596
00:49:56,720 --> 00:50:02,400
that Prince of Peace picture. And I was asked a long time, do you think that's really Jesus?

597
00:50:02,400 --> 00:50:06,160
I said, she did the best she could in describing what she saw.

598
00:50:06,160 --> 00:50:07,040
Beautiful.

599
00:50:07,040 --> 00:50:11,440
You know what I mean? And then I got other people that do the best they can in describing

600
00:50:11,440 --> 00:50:20,240
what they saw. I really believe that Jesus in that way shows himself in what we believe.

601
00:50:20,240 --> 00:50:26,080
Okay. Now when we get there, we get to see him as he is. And I got to see him as he is.

602
00:50:26,800 --> 00:50:31,200
Okay. And if you go further in that scripture, it says, and we shall be like him.

603
00:50:31,200 --> 00:50:31,700
Yeah.

604
00:50:33,760 --> 00:50:37,200
I don't know if people are ready for that part of it yet.

605
00:50:37,200 --> 00:50:44,400
Well, you know, if you think about all of the stuff that's coming from the dark side in

606
00:50:45,040 --> 00:50:50,640
creating characters that are shapeshifters, you know, those dark things probably were

607
00:50:50,640 --> 00:50:55,600
shapeshifters made in heaven to begin with. And then they chose the dark side.

608
00:50:56,880 --> 00:51:01,680
I'm just seeing Jesus as the number one shapeshifter. Is that safe to say?

609
00:51:01,680 --> 00:51:04,880
I want to make sure that people get on, you know how people are.

610
00:51:04,880 --> 00:51:05,380
Sure.

611
00:51:05,380 --> 00:51:08,820
They'll take that and they'll say, they're teaching shapeshifting.

612
00:51:08,820 --> 00:51:09,320
No, no.

613
00:51:12,900 --> 00:51:14,180
And that's not what we're saying here.

614
00:51:14,180 --> 00:51:18,420
No. But all I'm saying is that the dark side can't invent anything.

615
00:51:19,140 --> 00:51:23,620
Because in the book of Revelation, you see Jesus as the lamb of God slain from the foundation of

616
00:51:23,620 --> 00:51:29,220
the world. And you see him as the lion, the lion of the tribe of Judas. So he's actually

617
00:51:29,220 --> 00:51:35,620
shapeshifting. Did you see any of that? Oh, yeah. Oh, yeah.

618
00:51:41,220 --> 00:51:43,140
We might have to save that for another podcast.

619
00:51:44,660 --> 00:51:50,660
Well, and I would love to share those things with people. But like I said earlier, and when we first

620
00:51:50,660 --> 00:51:57,380
started, people get into their realm or their boxes and they get stuck, you know, and I don't

621
00:51:57,380 --> 00:52:02,580
want to hurt anybody. You know what I mean? And sometimes people want to believe a certain way.

622
00:52:03,140 --> 00:52:08,180
It's simple as this, Sharon. When I say you get to heaven, everything is right. There's nothing

623
00:52:08,180 --> 00:52:15,060
wrong. It's past peace. I had a lady come up to me years ago and said, I want peace in heaven.

624
00:52:15,060 --> 00:52:20,900
And she almost started crying. Not understanding. What I was saying was that peace

625
00:52:20,900 --> 00:52:28,100
is past understanding. You understand what I mean? And she was stuck with, I got to get to heaven,

626
00:52:28,100 --> 00:52:34,100
there's got to be peace. And I'm saying, it's past peace. And I don't know if she had her own

627
00:52:34,100 --> 00:52:39,860
situation, you was going through or what. But there's people that are out there and she thought

628
00:52:39,860 --> 00:52:44,820
she was advanced in the kingdom of God. She thought she was knowledgeable in the kingdom of God. She

629
00:52:44,820 --> 00:52:50,340
thought, oh, I'm one of the chosen ones, you know, that type of thing. But then when she came up and

630
00:52:50,340 --> 00:52:58,740
said that to me, I thought, okay, she's stuck. Wow. Get a bribe her.

631
00:53:01,860 --> 00:53:07,060
So I'm believing that people that are listening to these, they're going to be able to hear and

632
00:53:07,060 --> 00:53:12,660
God's going to advance. And they probably could even share more scriptures than what we have

633
00:53:12,660 --> 00:53:21,620
shared because God does that. Yes, he does. And shape shifting is the world's way of putting it.

634
00:53:22,180 --> 00:53:26,020
That's why I used that expression because that's what people understand.

635
00:53:26,740 --> 00:53:30,420
Just from the dark side. But the dark side didn't create it. God did.

636
00:53:30,420 --> 00:53:37,380
Yeah. Can I mention something real quick? My dad had a picture of it and it was William Branham.

637
00:53:37,380 --> 00:53:42,820
Remember they had a halo over his head. Black and white photo. Do you remember that scene that

638
00:53:42,820 --> 00:53:48,100
you're in? Yeah. I remember someone said they had that painting, that picture rather back then

639
00:53:48,100 --> 00:53:54,580
hanging in the White House. Oh, wow. Yeah, this was years ago. It's probably not there now based on

640
00:53:54,580 --> 00:54:00,580
what administration is, you know. It's probably in the archives somewhere. It's in the archives.

641
00:54:00,580 --> 00:54:05,540
Wow. Let's go back to the shape shifting because I just want to read scripture. Yes, absolutely.

642
00:54:05,540 --> 00:54:10,100
It's kind of marked the 16th chapter. I'm going to start at the ninth verse because I just want

643
00:54:10,100 --> 00:54:16,100
to bring this into perspective with some of you out there that are listening. When Jesus rose early

644
00:54:16,100 --> 00:54:23,620
on the first day of the week, he appeared first to Mary of Magdalene, out of whom he had driven

645
00:54:23,620 --> 00:54:31,460
seven demons. She went and told those who had been with him who were mourning and weeping.

646
00:54:31,460 --> 00:54:39,380
When they learned that Jesus was alive and that she had seen him, they did not believe it. Okay?

647
00:54:40,260 --> 00:54:45,460
No. And that's probably one of our natural response to something that Jesus does sometimes.

648
00:54:45,460 --> 00:54:54,820
Yeah, because we saw him die. Yeah. And then it says, after Jesus appeared in a different form

649
00:54:54,820 --> 00:55:01,620
to two of them while they were walking in the country. And that we know that is found in Luke

650
00:55:01,620 --> 00:55:09,220
and we can read it. It is the road to the maus, you know. But it does say that he can, and this

651
00:55:09,220 --> 00:55:15,140
is the NIV version of it. Let me give you the New King James version because I like the way it says

652
00:55:15,140 --> 00:55:21,220
it too. And if anyone's listening, I want them to know it's in the scriptures. I didn't put it in

653
00:55:21,220 --> 00:55:26,020
there. Sharon didn't put it in there. Phil didn't put it in there, but it's in there. This is how it

654
00:55:26,020 --> 00:55:32,820
says it. And then after that, he appeared in another form to two of them as they walked and went

655
00:55:32,820 --> 00:55:40,340
into the country. Okay? Yes. So there it is in the New King James, the other one was NIV, saying

656
00:55:40,340 --> 00:55:45,700
that Jesus could literally transform himself to look different. And I really believe what I was

657
00:55:45,700 --> 00:55:50,340
seeing when I was there with the Father of Jesus in heaven was seeing the different forms he could

658
00:55:50,340 --> 00:55:57,300
take on because of how we think he should look, to be honest with you. And I usually say this,

659
00:55:57,300 --> 00:56:02,660
and it's kind of weak in the way I say it, I think, to me. It's not his form that saves you,

660
00:56:02,660 --> 00:56:07,860
it's Jesus that saves you. And the reason I say that, because we look at the form as being so

661
00:56:07,860 --> 00:56:14,020
significant, and the form is not that significant. It's the being that is there, which is Jesus

662
00:56:14,020 --> 00:56:19,620
Christ, that is significant. You know, in heaven, you and me talked about this before, and I'll bring

663
00:56:19,620 --> 00:56:31,940
it up again. And we're probably going in a circle. But you know, that's probably, oh, Sharon,

664
00:56:31,940 --> 00:56:37,700
something just opened up. Come on. We call it revelation. And I really believe revelation is

665
00:56:37,700 --> 00:56:44,340
just us going in a circle over something again, and getting a better, what do you call it?

666
00:56:44,340 --> 00:56:51,300
Perspective? Understanding of it. But we already went through that one already. And what hurts

667
00:56:51,300 --> 00:56:58,580
those that are not expanding or growing, are moving to the next level, is they stop going in

668
00:56:58,580 --> 00:57:04,900
the circle, if you think about it. They stop growing. You know, they stop going. I read my

669
00:57:04,900 --> 00:57:09,300
scriptures back. You probably, you and Phil probably read your Bible, I don't know how many

670
00:57:09,300 --> 00:57:14,340
times scripture's how many times. But even though we still can go back to it, and we learn something

671
00:57:14,340 --> 00:57:21,700
new every time, or we see something. You know? And so that's that circular motion that we get to go

672
00:57:21,700 --> 00:57:26,900
through. I think it's the spiral motion that gets bigger. It gets bigger. If people are doing it

673
00:57:26,900 --> 00:57:32,180
just in a flat circle, a one-dimensional circle, they're going to get stuck. They're not going to

674
00:57:32,180 --> 00:57:42,020
go any further. Yeah, I could see that. That circle's in a box now. Well, I was there. I

675
00:57:42,020 --> 00:57:48,820
can't tell people. I was in that box too. My circle's in a box. Yeah. You had a lot of experiences

676
00:57:48,820 --> 00:57:54,340
that you weren't prepared for. Oh, yeah. Oh yeah. Yeah. But this was one of them.

677
00:57:54,340 --> 00:58:00,020
That's the see the different forms. I can remember laying in the hospital room, thinking about this.

678
00:58:00,020 --> 00:58:04,740
And if you would have saw me, you would have saw a puzzle face. I would have one of those puzzle

679
00:58:04,740 --> 00:58:12,980
faces. What is going on here? What is this? I know this is what I saw. I get to see him as he is.

680
00:58:12,980 --> 00:58:18,980
And I'm seeing him look different every moment as I'm looking at him. Yeah. You know? Yeah. Now there,

681
00:58:18,980 --> 00:58:26,820
I was not confused. I was not taken back by it. I wasn't like, wow. But when I got back on the planet

682
00:58:26,820 --> 00:58:33,380
in this body and I thought about it, that's when the thing started creeping in. Then what is going

683
00:58:33,380 --> 00:58:39,540
on here? And if it wasn't for this scripture that I read here, that he could transform himself.

684
00:58:40,580 --> 00:58:45,380
And then I asked, why didn't anybody say this to me? And I know why, because this would be

685
00:58:45,380 --> 00:58:52,980
very controversial in a number of ways, especially in your very dogmatic people that believe a certain

686
00:58:52,980 --> 00:58:58,900
way. Yeah. They've got a doctrine instead of an experience. Yeah. But they are not moving in a

687
00:58:59,780 --> 00:59:06,820
spiral, as you say, realm. They're still staying in a box realm because they figured it out. That's

688
00:59:06,820 --> 00:59:13,220
the way it is. That's how it is. Limited. But the reality of it is this right here says there's a

689
00:59:14,020 --> 00:59:21,940
circular or spiral learning process here. And then, oh man, that is so cool. Yeah. You know?

690
00:59:21,940 --> 00:59:26,020
Beautiful. If you really think about it. Yeah. Something that was opened up to me the other day

691
00:59:26,580 --> 00:59:33,220
about forgiveness, forgiving people. It says, if you don't forgive, how can he forgive you?

692
00:59:33,220 --> 00:59:37,700
Yes. You want me to forgive. You know what I mean? Yeah. And I always thought, wait a minute,

693
00:59:37,700 --> 00:59:43,540
when I got to heaven, there were people, I'm going to say this, some of you may not like it,

694
00:59:43,540 --> 00:59:48,260
that's going to hear it, but I'm going to say it anyway. When I got to heaven, none of that stuff

695
00:59:48,260 --> 00:59:56,500
that I didn't forgive people for was brought up. Okay. When I got back to earth, I remember

696
00:59:57,060 --> 01:00:02,340
thinking in my hospital room, oh, I have an ought against this person. I have an ought against this

697
01:00:02,340 --> 01:00:07,300
person. I need to clean it up. Wow. You know? Someone said, well, you didn't stay. That's why

698
01:00:07,300 --> 01:00:16,340
you... No. I knew I could have stayed. I knew God accepted me. But those things were taken care of

699
01:00:16,340 --> 01:00:23,140
by him. Glory to God. And I got to be honest with you. I thought I took care of them. But when I got

700
01:00:23,140 --> 01:00:28,980
back to earth, I knew I didn't take care of them. I had an ought against my neighbor and I had an

701
01:00:28,980 --> 01:00:35,140
ought against a pastor. And I remember I had to make amends to both of them when I got back,

702
01:00:35,140 --> 01:00:39,460
and mainly because we were on the same team. Some of you out there need to hear that. We're on the

703
01:00:39,460 --> 01:00:45,060
same team. You may not like everything that we say or agree with everything, but our goal is to get

704
01:00:45,060 --> 01:00:48,420
people to know Jesus Christ as the Lord of the Saviour. We're on the same team. Absolutely.

705
01:00:49,300 --> 01:00:54,660
And we're not building no cult. You know what I mean? So we may do it different than you do,

706
01:00:54,660 --> 01:00:58,740
because that's what God has called us to do, to reach the people that he want to reach.

707
01:00:59,380 --> 01:01:04,900
And a lot of times people disagree with Paul because of who he went to, which was the Gentiles.

708
01:01:05,620 --> 01:01:10,020
Remember that? And some of the Jewish people got upset because he went to the Gentiles,

709
01:01:10,020 --> 01:01:15,620
but that's who God called him to go to, to minister to. And they didn't have to follow

710
01:01:15,620 --> 01:01:21,220
all the laws. And some of the people didn't like that. I think I'm talking to somebody out there

711
01:01:21,220 --> 01:01:26,020
right now, Sharon. They've been praying and God is talking to them. And that's why we're bringing

712
01:01:26,020 --> 01:01:34,900
this up. Okay? But the thing I want to go back is that forgiveness, I looked at it different than I

713
01:01:34,900 --> 01:01:42,180
ever looked at it before. And I thought, it's a flesh thing. It's God saying we're moving so much

714
01:01:42,180 --> 01:01:51,140
in our flesh that we can't move in our spirit and we're disconnected from him because we haven't

715
01:01:51,140 --> 01:01:56,900
forgiven that person like God wants us to forgive him. Oh, that's good. There's a disconnection

716
01:01:56,900 --> 01:02:01,860
there, you know? Yeah. And how are you going to serve God to the fullness when you haven't

717
01:02:01,860 --> 01:02:07,380
done what he told you to do? It goes back to that trusting and obedience. I liked what you said

718
01:02:07,380 --> 01:02:14,660
earlier about being obedient and you don't have to worry about the sacrifice. Yeah. That just came

719
01:02:14,660 --> 01:02:20,180
to me when you brought up the scripture. And because I think about how God started my journey

720
01:02:20,180 --> 01:02:27,220
on this, the first words he said to me was, trust me. And I felt like if I trust him, then I would

721
01:02:27,220 --> 01:02:32,980
have to go back and ask him to forgive me for not trusting him. Well, there you go.

722
01:02:34,100 --> 01:02:39,540
It was like, okay. So I just kind of linked that and I still, someone else out there,

723
01:02:39,540 --> 01:02:46,580
that unforgiveness because I know I had those two odds and yet I was still welcomed into heaven.

724
01:02:46,580 --> 01:02:50,900
And yet I know that scripture says, if you don't forgive others, how can he forgive you?

725
01:02:51,620 --> 01:02:56,420
You understand what I mean? Yeah. And that tells me that there's something I didn't understand in

726
01:02:56,420 --> 01:03:04,580
that scripture. And one of them is how it links to our flesh and that it stops me from serving him

727
01:03:04,580 --> 01:03:10,660
to the fullness because of not forgiving someone. Somebody out there, you need to hear that. Can I

728
01:03:10,660 --> 01:03:15,380
go a little bit further with that? Because someone needs prayer in that area. Someone's done you harm.

729
01:03:15,380 --> 01:03:21,780
They did terrible things to you and you're angry about it. It hurts you. And you're saying, Dean,

730
01:03:21,780 --> 01:03:26,260
I will never forgive them or I can't forgive them, but you want to serve God. This is where

731
01:03:26,260 --> 01:03:31,380
you're going to have to come into the realization. The love for God is going to have to be greater

732
01:03:31,380 --> 01:03:36,580
than the hatred of the person. And that means you're going to have to ask God to help you

733
01:03:37,140 --> 01:03:43,060
because that's who does it. Most of the time we try to do it ourselves, but you need to pray and

734
01:03:43,060 --> 01:03:48,740
ask God to help you move to forgive that person. That doesn't mean you put yourself back in the

735
01:03:48,740 --> 01:03:55,060
same situation, especially if it's physical abuse or some kind of abuse that you were being,

736
01:03:55,060 --> 01:04:02,100
and they were just bad. God is not asking you to put yourself back in that situation. He's asking

737
01:04:02,100 --> 01:04:08,660
you to let him take care of the situation and you move on. That means you forgive them and move on.

738
01:04:10,500 --> 01:04:16,820
And sometimes we have a hard time doing that. It comes down to what's greater for you,

739
01:04:16,820 --> 01:04:24,580
the love for God or the love that hates someone. I'm using that word the way I'm using it for a

740
01:04:24,580 --> 01:04:31,060
reason. Because you may say, I don't love hating someone. Well, then you're putting it in the same

741
01:04:31,060 --> 01:04:37,220
realm as the love for God. And so, if you're putting it in the same realm as the love for God,

742
01:04:37,220 --> 01:04:43,380
then you're loving to hate someone. Whoa, somebody knows that in your heart right now.

743
01:04:43,380 --> 01:04:50,180
And God is saying, nope, they cannot be in the same area. One's going to be in the area and the

744
01:04:50,180 --> 01:04:56,420
other one is not going to be in the area. So, if you say you love God, let it go. Ask God to help

745
01:04:56,420 --> 01:05:03,300
you forgive them and move on. And watch how your life changes. I mean, some of you are sick right

746
01:05:03,300 --> 01:05:10,420
now and you can't move past the illness because of the love that you have to hate someone or not

747
01:05:10,420 --> 01:05:17,860
to get someone. Okay? And that's keeping you sick. Some of you right now financially, you're having

748
01:05:17,860 --> 01:05:23,460
trouble with your finances and you wonder why. That's why you need to move past it. And as soon

749
01:05:23,460 --> 01:05:29,540
as you move past it, God will bless you. He will bless you with healing. He will bless you with

750
01:05:29,540 --> 01:05:34,660
finances. There are going to be things that happen in your life, relationships, fellowships

751
01:05:35,460 --> 01:05:40,740
with family members. Some of you have broken family ship because of the hate that you have

752
01:05:40,740 --> 01:05:48,500
for someone. Okay? And then there's you that are out there that have not forgiven yourself. You say

753
01:05:48,500 --> 01:05:54,340
you have, but in reality, you haven't. You always think you're not worthy enough or not good enough.

754
01:05:54,340 --> 01:06:00,260
And God's not even asked us to think that way, whether we're worthy or not worthy. He just asks

755
01:06:00,260 --> 01:06:08,740
you to do it. It's just a drug deal. And I would say to you, just trust Him. Don't go and try to do

756
01:06:08,740 --> 01:06:13,780
it like a Moses. You that read your Bible know what Moses did. And I have the right word to say.

757
01:06:14,420 --> 01:06:22,020
I stutter. Who am I? He just wants you to go forward right now. You could be concerned with

758
01:06:22,020 --> 01:06:29,940
all that when you get to heaven. All right? So Sharon, that's what I really feel like. And

759
01:06:29,940 --> 01:06:34,340
while I should say this, you're not going to be concerned with it in heaven. You're not even going

760
01:06:34,340 --> 01:06:40,820
to think about it. Okay? But the reality of it is that it's something that God is just saying right

761
01:06:40,820 --> 01:06:46,740
now, especially during this time period, God is wanting to move forward in a number of areas.

762
01:06:47,380 --> 01:06:53,860
And He wants to use you to be able to move in that direction. Not that you develop what He wants you

763
01:06:53,860 --> 01:07:00,500
to do, that He develops what He wants you to do. There's a difference. Because if you develop what

764
01:07:00,500 --> 01:07:05,940
He wants you to do, then it's His work. If you develop what you want to do, then it becomes your

765
01:07:05,940 --> 01:07:11,620
work. And your work ain't going to go too far. But His work is going to go through that circular

766
01:07:11,620 --> 01:07:16,740
or that spiral that me and Sharon and Phil have been talking about. And it's going to get greater

767
01:07:16,740 --> 01:07:22,100
and greater and greater. And you were created for that. So don't even look for an end. Don't look

768
01:07:22,100 --> 01:07:31,540
for an end. I just felt like I really needed to say that because of what we were saying today.

769
01:07:32,100 --> 01:07:38,340
Someone, Sharon was trapped in their circle. And I like the way you say it's a spiral. God is getting

770
01:07:38,340 --> 01:07:44,180
them out of it. And I feel like from the things that you've been saying, I think it will help

771
01:07:44,180 --> 01:07:50,020
people to understand that the pain that we've experienced, the trauma that we've experienced,

772
01:07:50,020 --> 01:07:59,540
the hurt, those things are hurting in our flesh, in our emotions, in the carnal part of us,

773
01:07:59,540 --> 01:08:07,060
the earthly part of us. Our spirit, the real you is your spirit. And the real you is connected to

774
01:08:07,060 --> 01:08:15,060
Holy Spirit. And if Jesus lives inside of you, because you've asked Him to, if Jesus lives inside

775
01:08:15,060 --> 01:08:22,660
of you, He is the master forgiver. He's the one who from the cross where He had been so horribly,

776
01:08:22,660 --> 01:08:28,740
horribly treated, hurt more than, hurt way more than any of us have ever been hurt. If you roll

777
01:08:28,740 --> 01:08:34,340
all of our hurts together, that's what He went through. And He was the one from the cross that

778
01:08:34,340 --> 01:08:40,820
said, Father, forgive them. They know not what they do. So if you just get in touch with Jesus

779
01:08:40,820 --> 01:08:48,980
inside of you and begin to let His words of intercession for the ones who hurt Him, all of

780
01:08:48,980 --> 01:08:57,060
us, all of us caused His wounds, then it takes the load off of you and enables you to let it go

781
01:08:57,060 --> 01:09:01,220
because your spirit is the real you and you want to be free. The real you wants to be free.

782
01:09:01,780 --> 01:09:07,780
And so just let that thing go to Him by letting Him speak through you, Father, forgive them.

783
01:09:07,780 --> 01:09:13,540
They know not what they do. Amen. I didn't know we were going to end up doing that.

784
01:09:13,540 --> 01:09:15,300
Yeah, I didn't either. But Jesus did.

785
01:09:17,700 --> 01:09:23,620
But I want to always tie it back into the subject we were talking about, the spear, the spiral,

786
01:09:23,620 --> 01:09:29,140
you know, as we have covered it today. But the Lord, you know, I just feel there's an urgency.

787
01:09:29,140 --> 01:09:34,740
I don't know about you two. There's an urgency that God is pouring out on people, global outpouring,

788
01:09:34,740 --> 01:09:41,380
people along with this. There's an urgency right now that He wants us to understand these things.

789
01:09:41,380 --> 01:09:47,380
As you said earlier, those that are listening, they enhance us to do what He wants us to do on

790
01:09:47,380 --> 01:09:55,460
the planet. And so we need to know these things because God is really wanting to do more. He just

791
01:09:55,460 --> 01:10:01,540
wants to do more. And you that are listening, tag you in. That's good.

792
01:10:01,540 --> 01:10:05,860
That is good. Amen.

793
01:10:31,540 --> 01:10:43,860
And I'm Philip Buss.

794
01:10:43,860 --> 01:11:02,180
God bless you with this overwhelming loving presence.