(257) “Restoring Purity in the Body of Christ” with Jeff Symons

WEBVTT

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Nobody ever takes accountability for those inaccurate

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prophecies. And I think that we all have known

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that those things have been an issue. It's just

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coming to the surface now where I actually think

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it's the Lord refining us in a way that we can

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have purity in the Spirit again. God promises

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in Joel 2 .28 to pour out His Spirit on all humanity.

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Welcome to Global Outpouring, where we contend

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for that promised outpouring, and we equip for

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that outpouring so that we may engage in that

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very outpouring. I'm Philip Buss. And I'm Sharon

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Buss. Welcome to the podcast today. We're so

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glad that you're with us. We have with us today

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our friend Jeff Simons, who is going to be one

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of our speakers at the convention 2025 coming

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up in St. Louis. And we encourage you to be there

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with us. But we're going to have a discussion

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about the things that the Lord is showing him

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and leading him to bring to the body about restoring

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purity in the body of Christ. Thanks for joining

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us today. If you haven't already done so, before

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we get started, we want to encourage you to go

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to our website, globaloutpouring .net. Make sure

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that you're on our mailing list, our email list.

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so that we can stay in touch with you, keep you

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informed of what we're doing. While you're out

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there, you can also look at the event page for

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Convention 2025. We have all of our speakers

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lined up now. We're going to have Siggy Oblander

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opening for us, and Tony Kemp will be ministering,

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and Dean Braxton, and Jeff Simons is one of our

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speakers. Jean Little, and I'll be speaking also,

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and we're just going to have a glory time in

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the presence of the Lord. His presence is always

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so amazingly manifest at this convention because

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He just loves to connect with us, and we love

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to connect with Him. We'll have deep worship.

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tremendous intercession and we'll have flags

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of the nations around the room and you can pray

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over the nations. There's tremendous intercessions

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going to go on and opening the word, it'll be

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deep and glorious and you'll be able to make

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new friends and relationships that'll go on for

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eternity. So we want to encourage you to plan

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to be with us May 21st through 24th in St. Louis.

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at the St. Louis Airport Marriott Hotel. It's

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going to be a glory time. Please make your plans

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to be there. Well, Jeff Simons, it's such a pleasure

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to have you with us on the Global Outpouring

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Podcast again. It's been about a year or so since

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we've had you with us and since you had us with

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you on your podcast. So welcome. We're glad you're

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with us. Well, thank you very much. It's good

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to be here. We were chatting before we started.

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on this, just trying to get the mind of the Lord

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of what direction he wants to take us. First

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of all, I just want to say that we're looking

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forward to having you with us at Convention 2025

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at the St. Louis Airport Marriott Hotel, because

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I feel like there's such a connection in the

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spirit. When we connected a year ago, I just

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really felt like there's a real connection. And

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then you came here for the Eclipse event that

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we had in April of last year. And we just felt

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like family right from the get -go. So I don't

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know if you have any leading yet as to what you're

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going to be ministering on at the convention.

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But if it comes out in this conversation, that

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would be good. But we just want people to get

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to know you. And we'll encourage folks to go

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back to the recording that we did a year ago.

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And we'll put a link to it in the show notes.

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So you have your own podcast, the Kingdom Awakening

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podcast. That's the name of your ministry. Oh,

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and tell us that little piece that you told us

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a year ago about. of the names that you were

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possibly considering for your ministry. What

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was one of those? Well, there was outpouring

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international. There was global outpouring was

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one of the ones that I was considering. And those

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two are what we were considering too. Isn't that

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a stunning thing? I just love that. Yeah. That

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is so amazing. So you have that podcast and you

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have a podcast with John Mark Baker called Minor

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Prophets. And I've listened in on some of the

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things that you have been tackling, talking about

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the stuff that's going on, the exposures that

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are going on in the church, in ministries where

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people who have not been acting according to

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the word of God are being exposed for it. What

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I heard that you and John Mark were sharing together,

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I appreciate how you handled it. Just give us

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a little bit of your heart about that subject.

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Well, first, thank you for appreciating how we

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handled it. Not everybody had that response.

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It's interesting because it's dancing a fine

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line, right, where there's entire camps that

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have been publicly stating things against charismatic

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ministers for a long period of time. They don't

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have an audience to the charismatic church because

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they denounce all things charismatic and cessationist

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and things like that. And we're coming in saying,

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OK, we're not in that camp, but we are acknowledging

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that there's issues in our own stream of the

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body. And and then the other extreme of that

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is those that have. I'm going to use my language,

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that have idolized individuals to such an extreme

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that they have a hard time acknowledging when

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one of those leaders or ministries does something

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that is either unbiblical or wounding of people.

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And we're not in that camp either. We need to

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be able to discern rightly. And there's places

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where we're trying to address. unbiblical practices

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that we have in the charismatic movement. As

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people that are in that movement, I speak in

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tongues and prophesy and pray for the sick and

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have encounters and miracles. My salvation story,

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I got saved and shortly after went to heaven.

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So I don't know what the different levels of

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charismatic are, but I have a shofar and I have

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a tallit. So that puts me up there. You may not

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catch me with the flags, but I'll think about

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it. So it really started, John Mark came as a

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guest onto my podcast on Kingdom Awakening. And

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we found that we both had a heart for seeing

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purity come back to the charismatic movement.

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Yes. And we started to find these areas where

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the things that we were quoting and saying didn't

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align biblically. Come on. And it was hard because

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you kind of have to distinguish between, okay,

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am I, we'll just take prophecy, for example,

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right? So in 1 Corinthians, we are commanded.

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One prophesies and the others judge the prophecy.

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Now, it doesn't mean you judge the prophet. It

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means you judge the prophecy. Well said. And

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the challenge that we have is we need to be able

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to say, okay, this is good. This is bad. That's

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accurate. That's inaccurate. And a lot of times,

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depending on somebody's background in our movement,

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they have their identity connected to certain

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aspects of this. So to them, if you judge...

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a prophecy, oh, you're judging, you're saying

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I'm not a prophet. And we're actually, we're

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not making any statements about, you know, offices

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or titles or anything like that. But we're saying,

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okay, we need to judge prophecy. We're supposed

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to be doing this. Yes. And it's a clear example

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of what we have lost. And I want to make sure

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that I'm clearly stating this is my opinion.

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I believe that we have significantly lost credibility

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to the world. We lost a lot of credibility in

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2020. We've lost credibility since then, where

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there are certain prophetic voices that are saying

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that they're going to heaven and seeing Santa

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Claus and fictional characters. Which, okay,

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so we have a bunch of bad things that are out

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there. That wouldn't be an issue. if we were

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actually calling balls and strikes. If we were

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saying, okay, for example, say that our podcast

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existed two years ago and we had people that

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were on and sharing the prophetic word for the

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year and things of that nature. And somebody

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said, in this next year, we're going to have

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World War III by the end of 2024. And then 2024

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rolls, comes through in the end of 2024. I then

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have a responsibility to the audience. to clarify

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and say, we have this person on, and we can't

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particularly speak to what they were hearing

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or not hearing, but we know that that word did

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not come to pass. And it means that we need to

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then view future words with a higher degree of

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scrutiny. It doesn't mean that we fully discredit

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the individual. Oftentimes, it's a learning experience.

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True. I remember there was a time, and this was

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fairly early in my, and my growth in the prophetic

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where I had a friend call me and he said, Hey,

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give me a, give me a word from the Lord. And

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you know, if you, you get a reputation and people,

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it's well -intentioned and you know, they just

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want clarity from the Lord on a particular subject.

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And I, I saw a picture of somebody running. So

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I, you know, I immediately spiritualize it and

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said, OK, well, the Lord is saying that you're

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running your race and that you need to persevere

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and endure and you're going to run your race

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well. And, you know, I forget what all I said

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because it was wrong. But he said, well, I'm

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going to receive your interpretation. I was I

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was asking the Lord what I needed to do to lose

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weight. And so it was a literal word that I spiritualized

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rather than just taking what I heard and communicating

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that. So I'm not saying that we can't miscommunicate

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things, but we have made the exception the rule.

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And I think this is true in a lot of different

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things, actually, where we have exceptions biblically

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for a conditional versus an unconditional prophetic

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word. There's times where you have an option

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whether or not you see the fulfillment of the

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word. So an example of that is Agabus giving

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the word to Paul and Paul says, you know what,

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I'm going to go to Jerusalem anyway. He didn't

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have to. He had a response to seeing that fulfillment.

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The problem is most of the time the people that

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teach on conditional prophetic words never get

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an unconditional prophetic word and they don't

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get them accurate. So it's creating a loophole

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where I'm never accountable for anything prophetic.

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So I think that we have to get back to authentic

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prophecy, to not trying to be the next superstar

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of prophetic and have the next gigantic word.

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Because like I was talking to one of the leaders

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from International House of Prayer, and he was

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talking about the challenges that he's had with

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individuals that have sold their homes and relocated

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based on doomsday prophecy. from certain ministries.

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And he said, it's so damaging to these families

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to have those types of things. I'm like, yeah,

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you're right. And he said, and they never get

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fixed up. They never get cleaned up. Nobody ever

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takes accountability for those inaccurate prophecies.

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And I think that we all have known that those

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things have been an issue. It's just coming to

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the surface now where... I actually think it's

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the Lord refining us in a way that we can have

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purity in the Spirit again. Absolutely. You know,

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I have continually been repeating the Scripture,

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everything that can be shaken is being shaken,

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so that that which cannot be shaken will remain.

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And that's a good thing. It's a wonderful thing

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that our Father cares enough about us to bring

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us correction. You know, correction is not rejection.

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Right. And we have to have correction or else,

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you know, Paul says we're bastards. If you don't

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get the correction, you know. He disciplines

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those he loves. Exactly. He who he loves, he

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chastises. Exactly. So we have to embrace these

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things. And God said, I'm starting at my church.

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But he's wanting to shake everything. everything

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is being shaken. And we're seeing more of that

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now, that everything is being shaken so that

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that which cannot be shaken will remain. And

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it's a good thing. We just have to say thank

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you to our Father and run to Him, run to that

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mercy seat, because that's where we get back

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on the purity train, you know, the righteousness

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train. That's the path. It's the path. It's the

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derrick. It's the way. And our father spelled

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it out for us so clearly in his word. It's Isaiah

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35, 8. And a highway shall be there, and it shall

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be called the way of holiness. The unclean shall

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not pass over it. It shall be long to those who

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walk on the way. Even if they are fools, they

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shall not go astray. So even the very simplest

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of people, if they'll just get into line with

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the word. You're not going to fall off the way

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if you get where you understand there is a soulish,

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fleshly way, and there is a spirit way, Holy

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Spirit way, a word way. And what does Romans

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8 say? Verse 14, for all who are led by the Spirit

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of God are sons of God. And that word sons is

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the mature sons, the ones that are old enough

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to... have been working with dad long enough

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that they know how he thinks and they've been

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trusted with the checkbook and the keys to the

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office and they can write contracts for dad and

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sign contracts for dad and dad will say, yeah,

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I'll stand behind that, you know, because they're

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mature. They've worked with him long enough.

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That's where we've slipped a lot, where we have

00:14:39.149 --> 00:14:42.389
not. I mean, the whole point of the fivefold

00:14:42.389 --> 00:14:45.909
ministry is to bring up everybody in the congregation

00:14:45.909 --> 00:14:50.409
into a place of ministry rather than being out

00:14:50.409 --> 00:14:54.129
there as, you know, I'm the hero. And I'm not

00:14:54.129 --> 00:14:57.169
saying that specifically about anybody, but there

00:14:57.169 --> 00:15:00.350
can be that tendency to think of ourselves more

00:15:00.350 --> 00:15:03.330
highly than we ought to think. Right. And one

00:15:03.330 --> 00:15:05.330
of the themes that's kind of come up a few times

00:15:05.330 --> 00:15:10.690
recently is the sins of Eli. And, you know, that's

00:15:10.690 --> 00:15:13.649
something that's been repeated from multiple

00:15:13.649 --> 00:15:16.269
different sources that have said, I feel like

00:15:16.269 --> 00:15:18.750
we're dealing with the sins of Eli. Yes. And

00:15:18.750 --> 00:15:22.970
while I think that's true, I also think the Lord

00:15:22.970 --> 00:15:25.990
impressed upon me one time that Samuel, when

00:15:25.990 --> 00:15:30.809
Israel first cried out for a king, it was because

00:15:30.809 --> 00:15:39.500
of the wickedness of Samuel's sons. to deliver

00:15:39.500 --> 00:15:42.840
Israel from under the sins of Eli through Samuel,

00:15:43.100 --> 00:15:46.980
Samuel repeated the same thing. It's very true.

00:15:47.159 --> 00:15:50.639
That Samuel still didn't train up his sons to

00:15:50.639 --> 00:15:54.820
walk after the Lord. And you could look not to

00:15:54.820 --> 00:15:57.399
identify any particular ministry, but you could

00:15:57.399 --> 00:16:00.460
go back to the Kansas City prophets and say,

00:16:00.559 --> 00:16:04.100
okay, they identified issues with Paul Cain and

00:16:04.100 --> 00:16:06.480
with Bob Jones, and they had the courage to confront

00:16:06.480 --> 00:16:09.940
those leaders at that time. And now those same

00:16:09.940 --> 00:16:12.179
ministries that had the courage to confront then

00:16:12.179 --> 00:16:15.740
are the ones that are being challenged now. And

00:16:15.740 --> 00:16:19.000
I think that in many ways, and I've said this

00:16:19.000 --> 00:16:21.679
to several other ministers in this process, we

00:16:21.679 --> 00:16:24.179
need to be able to say what's true and say what's

00:16:24.179 --> 00:16:26.740
false, say what's good and say what's bad. And

00:16:26.740 --> 00:16:30.039
at the same time, not think of ourselves as more

00:16:30.039 --> 00:16:34.820
highly than we ought. It's not like we are incapable

00:16:34.820 --> 00:16:38.320
of making the same error. And we need to make

00:16:38.320 --> 00:16:41.000
sure that we don't rebuild the thing that the

00:16:41.000 --> 00:16:44.850
Lord seems to be tearing down right now. the

00:16:44.850 --> 00:16:49.830
removal of idols, again, using my language, idols

00:16:49.830 --> 00:16:52.029
in the church where we have worshiped people

00:16:52.029 --> 00:16:54.269
instead of worshiping the Lord. And we will take

00:16:54.269 --> 00:16:57.610
a person's word and elevate it. If we're honest

00:16:57.610 --> 00:16:59.590
with ourselves in times, we'll elevate a quote

00:16:59.590 --> 00:17:02.309
from a certain minister above clear scripture.

00:17:03.149 --> 00:17:06.289
And, you know, so it's idolatry. And actually,

00:17:06.309 --> 00:17:08.589
it doesn't help that minister either. You know,

00:17:08.589 --> 00:17:11.720
that when Israel. Forgive me for bouncing around

00:17:11.720 --> 00:17:14.099
a little bit. But, you know, when Israel, when

00:17:14.099 --> 00:17:16.319
they come out of Egypt, right? The Israelites,

00:17:16.480 --> 00:17:18.859
right when they come out, they go to their neighbors,

00:17:19.059 --> 00:17:21.980
the Egyptians. They are given all this gold and

00:17:21.980 --> 00:17:24.400
all the blessing and everything. And they plundered

00:17:24.400 --> 00:17:27.160
Egypt, right? Yeah, right. So then they're out

00:17:27.160 --> 00:17:30.779
in the wilderness. It's been a minute. And they're

00:17:30.779 --> 00:17:33.079
waiting at Sinai. Moses is up there. And the

00:17:33.079 --> 00:17:35.339
very thing that was a blessing to them, given

00:17:35.339 --> 00:17:38.420
to them by the Lord, is what they melted and

00:17:38.420 --> 00:17:41.099
made an idol out of. The thing that was meant

00:17:41.099 --> 00:17:43.480
to be a blessing to them and to their household,

00:17:43.720 --> 00:17:46.480
they turned it into an idol. And I think we've

00:17:46.480 --> 00:17:49.740
done the same thing. The ministers of our day

00:17:49.740 --> 00:17:52.180
are meant to be a blessing to the body, to contribute

00:17:52.180 --> 00:17:56.099
to the body, and to serve and undergird us. But

00:17:56.099 --> 00:17:58.740
in many ways, we've turned them into idols, which

00:17:58.740 --> 00:18:02.559
was, it's to their detriment and to ours. I think

00:18:02.559 --> 00:18:05.039
we have to be intentional to avoid repeating

00:18:05.039 --> 00:18:10.029
that same mistake. Yes, absolutely. Before we

00:18:10.029 --> 00:18:12.450
hit the record button, we were talking about,

00:18:12.529 --> 00:18:16.690
you made a comment that I thought was quite amazing.

00:18:17.490 --> 00:18:20.329
You said we're gaslighting ourselves and calling

00:18:20.329 --> 00:18:24.250
it faith. Can you explain that? I think that's

00:18:24.250 --> 00:18:29.690
just a huge, huge statement. Well, gaslighting

00:18:29.690 --> 00:18:32.509
is kind of a buzz term, buzz word right now.

00:18:32.630 --> 00:18:34.549
Explain that, because not everybody will know

00:18:34.549 --> 00:18:37.490
that word. Back when we had gas stoves, if somebody

00:18:37.490 --> 00:18:39.869
asked you, did you leave the stove on enough

00:18:39.869 --> 00:18:42.950
times, even if you had turned it off, you might

00:18:42.950 --> 00:18:46.029
start to think that you had left it on because

00:18:46.029 --> 00:18:48.910
somebody tells you enough times. Gaslighting

00:18:48.910 --> 00:18:51.470
is essentially, I tell you something as though

00:18:51.470 --> 00:18:53.670
it's not true and just keep saying it over and

00:18:53.670 --> 00:18:57.069
over until you believe it. Sounds like the media.

00:18:57.250 --> 00:19:00.309
Yeah, I think the term maybe originally started

00:19:00.309 --> 00:19:04.230
when we had gas lights before electricity. And

00:19:04.230 --> 00:19:06.829
the first story that I've heard about is that

00:19:06.829 --> 00:19:08.950
this man was trying to convince his wife that

00:19:08.950 --> 00:19:11.109
she was going crazy. And he would turn the lights

00:19:11.109 --> 00:19:14.589
down and make her think that he wasn't being

00:19:14.589 --> 00:19:16.450
truthful and trying to make her think she was

00:19:16.450 --> 00:19:19.910
crazy. Gotcha. It's essentially lying over and

00:19:19.910 --> 00:19:23.259
over. Contradictory to what you know to be true.

00:19:23.640 --> 00:19:26.519
Yes, to make you think you're crazy. Right. If

00:19:26.519 --> 00:19:29.480
it's to somebody else, it's to convince them

00:19:29.480 --> 00:19:33.039
of whatever it is that you're lying about. You

00:19:33.039 --> 00:19:35.140
know, the sky is green, the sky is green, the

00:19:35.140 --> 00:19:38.119
sky is green, whatever. We gaslight ourselves

00:19:38.119 --> 00:19:41.359
and we call it faith. And there are certain teachings

00:19:41.359 --> 00:19:46.079
that can be incorrectly applied in a way that

00:19:46.079 --> 00:19:50.559
cause people to practice this. For example, a

00:19:50.559 --> 00:19:54.079
friend of mine had his marriage blew up recently,

00:19:54.180 --> 00:19:58.539
and he got divorced, not to his own fault. But

00:19:58.539 --> 00:20:02.200
in this process, he started to realize, oh, there's

00:20:02.200 --> 00:20:04.900
things I've done wrong in my marriage. And he

00:20:04.900 --> 00:20:08.140
starts to acknowledge these different areas of

00:20:08.140 --> 00:20:10.559
his heart where he had prioritized ministry or

00:20:10.559 --> 00:20:14.440
prioritized other things other than his marriage.

00:20:14.460 --> 00:20:17.539
Again, it doesn't. mean that that was necessarily

00:20:17.539 --> 00:20:20.619
the the only thing happening right but then all

00:20:20.619 --> 00:20:22.660
of a sudden he said i heard this message and

00:20:22.660 --> 00:20:25.740
i realized oh i'm righteous by faith i'm you

00:20:25.740 --> 00:20:27.940
know father thank you so much that i am i am

00:20:27.940 --> 00:20:30.420
by faith i'm right and and i said hang on a second

00:20:30.420 --> 00:20:33.700
you were having a moment where you were authentically

00:20:33.700 --> 00:20:38.220
repenting and you just shortcutted yourself from

00:20:38.220 --> 00:20:40.960
that process to say that because the reality

00:20:40.960 --> 00:20:44.339
is repentance can be painful Oh, yeah. Sure.

00:20:44.579 --> 00:20:47.480
Humbling. Humbling. Very humbling. It's acknowledging

00:20:47.480 --> 00:20:49.640
that you have done something wrong, that you

00:20:49.640 --> 00:20:53.099
have some way affected somebody else. And if

00:20:53.099 --> 00:20:56.799
it wasn't somebody else, another human, the Lord,

00:20:56.900 --> 00:21:00.980
and acknowledging ways that you have wounded

00:21:00.980 --> 00:21:05.619
somebody. It's not a fun process, but it is part

00:21:05.619 --> 00:21:09.910
of the process to acknowledge how our... decisions

00:21:09.910 --> 00:21:13.890
and actions and words have affected others. And

00:21:13.890 --> 00:21:17.410
if you shortcut that process and say, you know

00:21:17.410 --> 00:21:20.049
what, by faith right now, everything is perfect.

00:21:20.250 --> 00:21:22.930
That doesn't change the reality of what you've

00:21:22.930 --> 00:21:26.009
done. It doesn't change your inner heart even.

00:21:26.410 --> 00:21:29.029
What it is, is you're lying to yourself so that

00:21:29.029 --> 00:21:31.809
you feel okay. It's a way of trying to appease

00:21:31.809 --> 00:21:34.809
your conscience rather than actually doing the

00:21:34.809 --> 00:21:37.940
harder work of acknowledging. what the root issue

00:21:37.940 --> 00:21:39.960
was going on in your heart when you were doing

00:21:39.960 --> 00:21:43.480
those things. Right. Yeah. I've said for years

00:21:43.480 --> 00:21:47.619
that we all want to be humble, but we don't want

00:21:47.619 --> 00:21:50.019
to have to go through humiliation to get there.

00:21:50.819 --> 00:21:53.940
Right. So that's why it's important that we humble

00:21:53.940 --> 00:21:57.799
ourselves rather than. He'll exalt you in due

00:21:57.799 --> 00:22:02.079
time. Yeah. It's not right away time. Yeah. You

00:22:02.079 --> 00:22:03.640
got to walk through the whole thing. You got

00:22:03.640 --> 00:22:07.880
to finish the process. Absolutely. And I heard

00:22:07.880 --> 00:22:10.920
a story of a pastor the other day who he was

00:22:10.920 --> 00:22:15.180
sharing of how when he was early on to becoming

00:22:15.180 --> 00:22:18.640
a pastor, he had significant pride in his heart.

00:22:18.859 --> 00:22:21.819
And he would go to this donut shop for these

00:22:21.819 --> 00:22:24.599
leadership meetings with his leaders and he was

00:22:24.599 --> 00:22:27.500
meeting there every week. But he was so prideful

00:22:27.500 --> 00:22:30.839
and dictated to them what they should do that

00:22:30.839 --> 00:22:33.799
he got fired shortly after, after being on staff

00:22:33.799 --> 00:22:37.259
at this church. He gets a job at the donut shop.

00:22:38.160 --> 00:22:43.200
And one day he sees the leadership group come

00:22:43.200 --> 00:22:46.660
in that he used to lead. And the owner tells

00:22:46.660 --> 00:22:49.579
him, I want you to go wash the windows. He says,

00:22:49.680 --> 00:22:52.220
no, please, anything but washing the windows,

00:22:52.339 --> 00:22:55.519
anything else. And the owner said, no, you need

00:22:55.519 --> 00:22:59.460
to wash the windows. And the Lord told him. First

00:22:59.460 --> 00:23:01.400
window, second window, and he gets to the window

00:23:01.400 --> 00:23:03.859
in front of him. And the Lord told him, it wasn't

00:23:03.859 --> 00:23:06.740
humiliation that I desired for you. It was humility.

00:23:07.539 --> 00:23:11.539
And I think that humiliation, it's one of the

00:23:11.539 --> 00:23:14.440
ways that we get it. But it doesn't have to be

00:23:14.440 --> 00:23:17.740
that way. Right. If we're stubborn, if we double

00:23:17.740 --> 00:23:21.220
down in pride, the reason humility is a requirement

00:23:21.220 --> 00:23:23.839
is it creates space for us to receive his grace.

00:23:24.400 --> 00:23:28.160
Oh, that's beautiful. But if I'm full of pride,

00:23:28.440 --> 00:23:31.019
I actually can't receive the grace that God wants

00:23:31.019 --> 00:23:34.400
to bring to me. Very true. And I was just looking

00:23:34.400 --> 00:23:37.220
up at scripture, you know, humble yourself. In

00:23:37.220 --> 00:23:38.279
the sight of the Lord. In the sight of the Lord,

00:23:38.299 --> 00:23:41.000
he'll exalt you in due time. And that due time

00:23:41.000 --> 00:23:44.579
is Kairos. Oh, there you go. So it's a season.

00:23:44.720 --> 00:23:49.339
Yeah, it's a certain moment of opportunity that

00:23:49.339 --> 00:23:52.940
isn't always there. How long is your season depends

00:23:52.940 --> 00:23:56.890
how. Humble you are. How quickly. How quickly

00:23:56.890 --> 00:24:00.089
you admit that you need help. Because really,

00:24:00.170 --> 00:24:03.490
we can't do this, even this on our own. It's

00:24:03.490 --> 00:24:07.269
a work of getting into agreement with the Holy

00:24:07.269 --> 00:24:10.329
Spirit when he's trying to polish and root out

00:24:10.329 --> 00:24:13.470
things that don't belong there. And, you know,

00:24:13.529 --> 00:24:15.990
iron sharpens iron. So sometimes he puts us with

00:24:15.990 --> 00:24:19.769
other kind of people that are just. Way too similar

00:24:19.769 --> 00:24:23.730
to ourselves. What are they used to polish diamonds

00:24:23.730 --> 00:24:26.589
with? Other diamonds, yeah. Other diamonds. Yeah.

00:24:26.670 --> 00:24:30.509
Oh, wow. It's just as hard. Let your light shine.

00:24:30.730 --> 00:24:33.269
You've got to go through some polishing. That's

00:24:33.269 --> 00:24:36.130
true. Never thought of it that way. But it's

00:24:36.130 --> 00:24:39.730
worth it. Yeah. Absolutely. Anything Jesus does

00:24:39.730 --> 00:24:43.710
for us is worth it. Yeah. Yeah. And I see that

00:24:43.710 --> 00:24:46.769
out of all of this correction that the Lord is

00:24:46.769 --> 00:24:50.589
bringing us. He's going to bring us into a place

00:24:50.589 --> 00:24:53.930
where we're going to be more palatable as believers

00:24:53.930 --> 00:24:58.069
to people who don't know Jesus. You know, there's

00:24:58.069 --> 00:25:01.069
a movement out there of people who are, they

00:25:01.069 --> 00:25:05.109
call themselves ex -evangelicals because of church

00:25:05.109 --> 00:25:08.069
hurt or whatever. And I heard a quote recently

00:25:08.069 --> 00:25:13.210
that there's no hate like Christian love, where

00:25:13.210 --> 00:25:18.000
people have encountered fleshly Christians. instead

00:25:18.000 --> 00:25:19.920
of Christians that are flowing in the love of

00:25:19.920 --> 00:25:24.400
God. The love of God is real. But the soulish

00:25:24.400 --> 00:25:27.740
nature, that's the part that we have to work

00:25:27.740 --> 00:25:32.839
out our own salvation in. Applying the finished

00:25:32.839 --> 00:25:35.700
work of Jesus, applying that grace, receiving

00:25:35.700 --> 00:25:38.920
that grace so that we can humble ourselves and

00:25:38.920 --> 00:25:41.740
admit that we're wrong and get back on the wagon

00:25:41.740 --> 00:25:48.599
of rolling with Jesus. Right. Sometimes we want

00:25:48.599 --> 00:25:52.700
the Lord to directly say everything to us. We

00:25:52.700 --> 00:25:56.220
only want to receive it from Him. And sometimes

00:25:56.220 --> 00:25:58.759
it can be harder to receive when it's, like you

00:25:58.759 --> 00:26:01.420
mentioned, that other person, that iron sharpening

00:26:01.420 --> 00:26:06.779
iron. So I have a practice that I do for my ministry.

00:26:06.880 --> 00:26:09.759
And I had a friend that just challenged me to

00:26:09.759 --> 00:26:12.440
increase the way I do it. It's actually, I covered

00:26:12.440 --> 00:26:15.380
it briefly. my book, which is the importance

00:26:15.380 --> 00:26:18.680
of correction. So every once a year, I ask all

00:26:18.680 --> 00:26:22.460
of the board members for our ministry to seek

00:26:22.460 --> 00:26:25.460
the Lord intentionally asking him correction

00:26:25.460 --> 00:26:28.000
that he has for me. It can be personal. It can

00:26:28.000 --> 00:26:30.880
be, it can be for the ministry. It can be any

00:26:30.880 --> 00:26:33.500
of it, anything. And inviting that correction

00:26:33.500 --> 00:26:38.500
where if I can get that practice down. I won't

00:26:38.500 --> 00:26:41.880
be shocked when people give me feedback of you

00:26:41.880 --> 00:26:44.960
did something wrong here or you need to correct

00:26:44.960 --> 00:26:48.359
this where it can become part of where I'm more

00:26:48.359 --> 00:26:52.500
receptive to correction from the Lord. And I

00:26:52.500 --> 00:26:54.460
had a friend who I was sharing this with him

00:26:54.460 --> 00:26:56.160
and he said, I would challenge you to have your

00:26:56.160 --> 00:26:59.160
kids ask you too. And I was like, oh, that's

00:26:59.160 --> 00:27:04.240
good. That's a really good idea. And I did ask

00:27:04.240 --> 00:27:06.619
my son. I don't remember if he had something.

00:27:07.480 --> 00:27:11.420
If he did, I wrote it down, but, um, actually,

00:27:11.519 --> 00:27:13.140
no, I remember he hasn't got back to me yet,

00:27:13.160 --> 00:27:20.900
but the, um, it's teenagers. Yeah. Maybe dad,

00:27:20.940 --> 00:27:23.559
you didn't let me borrow the Mustang to go drive

00:27:23.559 --> 00:27:30.000
when I wanted to, you know, but, um, but really

00:27:30.000 --> 00:27:32.289
what we, what. if we can get this as a common

00:27:32.289 --> 00:27:35.289
practice, what we start doing is we give people

00:27:35.289 --> 00:27:37.769
permission to say the things that have been going

00:27:37.769 --> 00:27:41.130
on that they've been feeling or negatively experiencing

00:27:41.130 --> 00:27:43.490
us because not everything is, is something that

00:27:43.490 --> 00:27:45.150
you're doing intentionally. You may, I mean,

00:27:45.150 --> 00:27:46.849
in all likelihood you're doing it. You're not

00:27:46.849 --> 00:27:48.849
aware of it. You're not aware of how other people

00:27:48.849 --> 00:27:51.210
are receiving you. Yeah. That's why Jesus said,

00:27:51.289 --> 00:27:52.809
father, forgive them. They know not what they

00:27:52.809 --> 00:27:54.750
do. Most of the time people don't know what they're

00:27:54.750 --> 00:28:00.079
doing. Right. Some of. you know, call it in the

00:28:00.079 --> 00:28:02.640
charismatic, we call it Jezebel and in psychology,

00:28:02.819 --> 00:28:08.019
they call it narcissism. Okay. Call it what you

00:28:08.019 --> 00:28:10.519
want. Most of the time when people are operating

00:28:10.519 --> 00:28:12.359
in those things, they don't know that they are

00:28:12.359 --> 00:28:15.599
like that to them. It's normal. This, this is

00:28:15.599 --> 00:28:17.599
what they experienced and this is normal for

00:28:17.599 --> 00:28:22.079
them. And if they can have enough humility to

00:28:22.079 --> 00:28:24.599
ask the question of, okay, am I doing something

00:28:24.599 --> 00:28:28.430
that is contrary to how the Lord would have me

00:28:28.430 --> 00:28:30.849
either lead or, you know, whether it be a family,

00:28:30.869 --> 00:28:33.410
a ministry, whatever, then you can start to adjust

00:28:33.410 --> 00:28:36.210
those things and not assume. And this is what

00:28:36.210 --> 00:28:38.309
most of us do, right? We assume that we're doing

00:28:38.309 --> 00:28:41.710
everything correctly and we just keep going until

00:28:41.710 --> 00:28:44.549
the Lord says something or we hit a dead end

00:28:44.549 --> 00:28:46.190
and we're like, oh, wait, what was that? You

00:28:46.190 --> 00:28:48.569
know, and it doesn't have to be that way. Right.

00:28:49.230 --> 00:28:52.210
Absolutely. What else is the Lord speaking to

00:28:52.210 --> 00:28:55.950
you about besides that? kind of thing, looking

00:28:55.950 --> 00:28:59.670
at the body of Christ and seeing where we need

00:28:59.670 --> 00:29:01.829
improvement. What else is the Lord saying to

00:29:01.829 --> 00:29:04.410
you? Well, one I've just been asking the Lord,

00:29:04.430 --> 00:29:07.710
a lot of times He'll speak to you even through

00:29:07.710 --> 00:29:12.769
people's accusations. If we can get an ear for

00:29:12.769 --> 00:29:17.329
it, where even somebody that doesn't have the

00:29:17.329 --> 00:29:19.930
Lord's heart on something, there can still be

00:29:19.930 --> 00:29:23.089
elements of truth in it. that if we can humble

00:29:23.089 --> 00:29:25.549
ourselves and listen to. So I've been asking,

00:29:25.670 --> 00:29:28.470
since we've done the Minor Prophets podcast,

00:29:28.609 --> 00:29:31.089
we've had a handful of negative responses that

00:29:31.089 --> 00:29:34.450
I actually, I enjoy taking those before the Lord

00:29:34.450 --> 00:29:36.549
and asking, Lord, okay, what of this? Because

00:29:36.549 --> 00:29:38.769
it's actually, if we can, again, if we can have

00:29:38.769 --> 00:29:42.230
that right heart posture, then it means that

00:29:42.230 --> 00:29:44.609
negative things can quickly be turned around

00:29:44.609 --> 00:29:47.980
into refinement of character. Beautiful. So I've

00:29:47.980 --> 00:29:50.140
been asking the Lord, okay, Lord, is my heart

00:29:50.140 --> 00:29:53.180
right when I said this, when I did that, those

00:29:53.180 --> 00:29:57.640
types of things. And interestingly, as you mentioned

00:29:57.640 --> 00:29:59.740
before, the Lord is shaking everything that can

00:29:59.740 --> 00:30:03.720
be shaken. And humility is the key right now.

00:30:04.960 --> 00:30:06.619
Judgment is coming to the house of the Lord.

00:30:06.680 --> 00:30:09.190
The Lord is the one doing it. And I also believe

00:30:09.190 --> 00:30:11.509
that the Lord is restoring authentic shepherds

00:30:11.509 --> 00:30:14.670
to the body, those that care primarily about

00:30:14.670 --> 00:30:18.230
the people, not about building followings. And

00:30:18.230 --> 00:30:20.470
I'm not saying that we haven't had that because

00:30:20.470 --> 00:30:24.049
I believe that we have. Yes. I think it's really

00:30:24.049 --> 00:30:27.690
the minority that have had these issues, right?

00:30:27.789 --> 00:30:30.630
I hope. I hope it's not the majority. You know,

00:30:30.670 --> 00:30:34.170
I'm reluctant to say just because. a lot of times

00:30:34.170 --> 00:30:36.970
and i'm sure you guys have seen this for me anyway

00:30:36.970 --> 00:30:39.190
i assume when i get a word from the lord that

00:30:39.190 --> 00:30:42.210
it somehow it has some broad meaning to everybody

00:30:42.210 --> 00:30:45.009
and you know or at least i did at some at one

00:30:45.009 --> 00:30:47.769
point and i don't think that's necessarily representative

00:30:47.769 --> 00:30:50.309
of the entirety of the body so just because he

00:30:50.309 --> 00:30:52.630
says something to me about the you know the stream

00:30:52.630 --> 00:30:56.109
that i'm in it may not apply to others i don't

00:30:56.109 --> 00:30:59.079
know is what I would say. I think that we have,

00:30:59.140 --> 00:31:01.200
there's plenty of authentic pastors that are

00:31:01.200 --> 00:31:03.819
just serving in their local church and doing

00:31:03.819 --> 00:31:06.539
their best to build up people on a weekly basis.

00:31:06.920 --> 00:31:10.019
Yes, absolutely. It's interesting. You know,

00:31:10.039 --> 00:31:13.680
one of the words that was coming or swirling

00:31:13.680 --> 00:31:17.279
around was the spirit of accusation or the accuser

00:31:17.279 --> 00:31:19.960
of the brethren, right? And I was asking the

00:31:19.960 --> 00:31:21.900
Lord, I'm like, Lord, where are these? Are these

00:31:21.900 --> 00:31:24.380
happening right now? And is this something that...

00:31:24.759 --> 00:31:27.279
am I functioning in any kind of accusation? And

00:31:27.279 --> 00:31:30.359
he kind of walked me through, okay, what is an

00:31:30.359 --> 00:31:33.339
accusation? Accusation is a false witness. So

00:31:33.339 --> 00:31:36.259
something that never happened. An accusation

00:31:36.259 --> 00:31:38.259
is something that's been redeemed. So you've

00:31:38.259 --> 00:31:41.339
repented for it. It's under the blood, but the

00:31:41.339 --> 00:31:44.380
enemy, this is what we see with the accuser,

00:31:44.380 --> 00:31:46.000
the brethren standing when he's standing before

00:31:46.000 --> 00:31:51.279
Joshua, right? And he's accusing him, but the

00:31:51.279 --> 00:31:54.890
Lord then changes his robes, right? So something

00:31:54.890 --> 00:31:56.970
that's already been redeemed or it's something

00:31:56.970 --> 00:31:59.529
true. And the intention or motive is to tear

00:31:59.529 --> 00:32:03.329
down. And when he said that last one, I was like,

00:32:03.390 --> 00:32:05.910
okay, when we're having these conversations about

00:32:05.910 --> 00:32:08.329
hard subjects, our goal is never to tear anything

00:32:08.329 --> 00:32:12.289
down. But that voice is going out there right

00:32:12.289 --> 00:32:14.869
now where there are those that are trying to,

00:32:14.910 --> 00:32:20.170
to tear things down. And unfortunately it's usually,

00:32:20.230 --> 00:32:22.670
and I'll just use this example because it's already

00:32:22.670 --> 00:32:25.849
known. for example, with Mike Bickle and IHOP,

00:32:26.009 --> 00:32:28.730
it was the people that were trying to silence

00:32:28.730 --> 00:32:32.589
all of these victims. They were accusing them

00:32:32.589 --> 00:32:36.450
of, you're just trying to take over IHOP, or

00:32:36.450 --> 00:32:38.210
you're just trying to tear down Mike Bickle.

00:32:38.369 --> 00:32:40.089
None of those things were true. There was no

00:32:40.089 --> 00:32:41.990
evidence of any of those things. It was just

00:32:41.990 --> 00:32:45.250
throwing accusation out there to try to draw

00:32:45.250 --> 00:32:48.630
attention away from the real thing that was happening,

00:32:48.730 --> 00:32:52.400
which was unfortunately significant. misconduct.

00:32:52.420 --> 00:32:55.960
Bad behavior. Yeah, yeah. We don't want the censor

00:32:55.960 --> 00:32:58.779
overlords to get us, but yes. Right. Horrible,

00:32:58.799 --> 00:33:02.400
horrible behavior. So is the spirit of accusation

00:33:02.400 --> 00:33:05.000
out there? Yeah, it is. And we need to be aware

00:33:05.000 --> 00:33:07.259
of it. That's why we need to speak the truth

00:33:07.259 --> 00:33:09.119
and speak it in love. But that doesn't mean that

00:33:09.119 --> 00:33:10.599
we don't speak the truth and it doesn't mean

00:33:10.599 --> 00:33:14.000
that we stop loving. Right. Yeah. And we're going

00:33:14.000 --> 00:33:15.359
a little over time, but I'm going to throw this

00:33:15.359 --> 00:33:19.880
at you anyway. You know, it's interesting. Have

00:33:19.880 --> 00:33:22.160
you ever thought about how You know, when Paul,

00:33:22.319 --> 00:33:25.859
when he's brought in front of, I believe it was

00:33:25.859 --> 00:33:28.440
in front of the Sanhedrin's Acts, it's Acts 23,

00:33:28.759 --> 00:33:34.519
where he actually intentionally sows discord

00:33:34.519 --> 00:33:37.880
between the Sadducees and the Pharisees. Start

00:33:37.880 --> 00:33:44.119
a riot. Where he used that because their ability

00:33:44.119 --> 00:33:48.160
to attack one another actually caused a disruption

00:33:48.160 --> 00:33:52.559
and it exposed an issue. Right. I actually think

00:33:52.559 --> 00:33:54.220
that we're seeing some of that happening right

00:33:54.220 --> 00:33:57.380
now in the church where there's some of the conflict

00:33:57.380 --> 00:34:00.500
that's happening is the Lord is allowing it because

00:34:00.500 --> 00:34:04.980
it's exposing things. Yes. Yes. You know, he's

00:34:04.980 --> 00:34:09.300
after a pure bride without spot or wrinkle. Right.

00:34:09.539 --> 00:34:14.139
That's really the bottom line. And when we are

00:34:14.139 --> 00:34:19.420
not focusing on his heart, on his ways, on...

00:34:20.079 --> 00:34:23.119
I remember hearing somebody say that there are

00:34:23.119 --> 00:34:26.300
rabbis, Orthodox rabbis, that will not marry

00:34:26.300 --> 00:34:29.179
a couple unless they look like brother and sister

00:34:29.179 --> 00:34:32.760
because they need to be that much alike in order

00:34:32.760 --> 00:34:36.400
for them to have a successful marriage. One of

00:34:36.400 --> 00:34:39.420
the things that I always tell young people that

00:34:39.420 --> 00:34:44.300
are considering, where's Mr. Right, where's Miss

00:34:44.300 --> 00:34:47.280
Right? I'm looking for the one that I want to

00:34:47.280 --> 00:34:49.579
spend the rest of my life with. And I tell them

00:34:49.579 --> 00:34:53.380
how God put Philip and me together. And we have

00:34:53.380 --> 00:34:57.119
a very successful marriage. Mostly, I think,

00:34:57.219 --> 00:35:01.679
well, mostly because God's in it. But a lot of

00:35:01.679 --> 00:35:04.260
it has to do with the fact that we were raised

00:35:04.260 --> 00:35:08.900
in a similar way with similar thought patterns.

00:35:08.940 --> 00:35:14.519
Our parents raised us in church. I was not raised

00:35:14.519 --> 00:35:18.090
Pentecostal like he was. But I got into it when

00:35:18.090 --> 00:35:22.090
I was 13. Well, you got filled with the Holy

00:35:22.090 --> 00:35:25.030
Spirit before I did. Yeah, right. But you had

00:35:25.030 --> 00:35:27.329
been exposed to it and I hadn't. But anyway,

00:35:27.429 --> 00:35:31.849
my point is that our lifestyle and our upbringing

00:35:31.849 --> 00:35:34.349
was very similar. And I'm not saying that you

00:35:34.349 --> 00:35:36.989
can't have a successful marriage if you don't

00:35:36.989 --> 00:35:39.889
have that. But what I'm saying is that our father

00:35:39.889 --> 00:35:45.070
is looking for someone just like his son to be

00:35:45.070 --> 00:35:47.610
able to marry him. and the body of Christ is

00:35:47.610 --> 00:35:51.389
meant to be that, that we're being refined by

00:35:51.389 --> 00:35:55.750
the Holy Spirit, like Galatians 5, where you've

00:35:55.750 --> 00:36:01.389
got all of this long list of fleshly works, and

00:36:01.389 --> 00:36:04.130
then you've got this list of the fruit of the

00:36:04.130 --> 00:36:07.190
Spirit. And if you read the fruit of the Spirit,

00:36:07.309 --> 00:36:10.500
you're looking at the character of Jesus. Right.

00:36:10.579 --> 00:36:14.960
So he's after us to work those things out in

00:36:14.960 --> 00:36:20.059
us. And the more we yield, the easier the process

00:36:20.059 --> 00:36:23.900
will be. And if we're really honest with ourselves,

00:36:24.000 --> 00:36:26.480
it's the only thing that really matters. Yes.

00:36:26.719 --> 00:36:31.000
And I was having a conversation with a friend

00:36:31.000 --> 00:36:33.599
the other day, and we were talking about the

00:36:33.599 --> 00:36:40.190
unspoken caste system. And Christian ministry.

00:36:40.389 --> 00:36:43.269
And I said, you know, at the top, it's itinerant

00:36:43.269 --> 00:36:46.030
minister if you're full time itinerant. And then,

00:36:46.030 --> 00:36:48.210
you know, if you're not if you're a pastor and

00:36:48.210 --> 00:36:50.070
you have an occasional conference here and there,

00:36:50.190 --> 00:36:52.389
then, you know, you're you're slightly below

00:36:52.389 --> 00:36:53.969
that. You know, people want to hear what you

00:36:53.969 --> 00:36:55.869
have to say, but you're not quite to that top

00:36:55.869 --> 00:36:59.030
tier where you get to travel all the time. And

00:36:59.030 --> 00:37:01.429
then, you know, below that, it's just, you know,

00:37:01.429 --> 00:37:03.429
full time local pastor. Your needs are taken

00:37:03.429 --> 00:37:06.389
care of. And, you know, people have a they have

00:37:06.389 --> 00:37:09.340
a need for. for you to shepherd over them, but

00:37:09.340 --> 00:37:12.380
you know, it's, and you get paid that way. But,

00:37:12.460 --> 00:37:15.059
and then below that, it's, well, a lay pastor,

00:37:15.099 --> 00:37:17.780
you know, you're, you're doing, or lay minister,

00:37:17.840 --> 00:37:20.380
you know, where you have a job and it's, you

00:37:20.380 --> 00:37:22.119
got to take care of your family, but your ministry

00:37:22.119 --> 00:37:25.739
thing isn't doing well enough that you're fully,

00:37:25.820 --> 00:37:29.159
you know, and it's, it's interesting how, and

00:37:29.159 --> 00:37:30.980
I see it as somebody that has a full -time job,

00:37:31.039 --> 00:37:33.400
you know, and it doesn't, it doesn't matter to

00:37:33.400 --> 00:37:35.960
me. Sometimes people will receive you differently.

00:37:36.480 --> 00:37:42.239
when they find out you have a job. Or if you're

00:37:42.239 --> 00:37:44.579
an itinerant minister, you show up and they're

00:37:44.579 --> 00:37:49.159
like, oh, they're finally here. The anointing

00:37:49.159 --> 00:37:54.280
has arrived. And some of them are scoundrels.

00:37:54.880 --> 00:38:00.260
Right, right. And I think you can have honor

00:38:00.260 --> 00:38:02.480
and hear what I'm saying, not what I'm not saying.

00:38:02.659 --> 00:38:04.800
There's something right about honoring people

00:38:04.800 --> 00:38:07.960
and things. Absolutely. In that we have actually

00:38:07.960 --> 00:38:11.199
in some passive way, we've communicated that

00:38:11.199 --> 00:38:14.480
when you're a really high performing Christian

00:38:14.480 --> 00:38:18.159
or you're really, really super spiritual, you're

00:38:18.159 --> 00:38:21.860
preaching conferences and or doing big crusades.

00:38:21.860 --> 00:38:25.820
And that is so contradictory to what we see in

00:38:25.820 --> 00:38:28.940
the gospel, you know, that we should be storing

00:38:28.940 --> 00:38:31.659
up treasure. in heaven not treasure on earth

00:38:31.659 --> 00:38:34.739
yeah and and what we do for the least of these

00:38:34.739 --> 00:38:37.199
what i if i give a cup of water to a child that's

00:38:37.199 --> 00:38:39.780
and i do that in his name that is doing it as

00:38:39.780 --> 00:38:43.760
unto him right and The things that we do, and

00:38:43.760 --> 00:38:46.000
this is a big part of the Sermon on the Mount,

00:38:46.059 --> 00:38:49.920
is the distinction between you say, but I say,

00:38:50.000 --> 00:38:53.739
you say, but I say. And you go and pray for people

00:38:53.739 --> 00:38:56.639
publicly to be seen by men so that they may honor

00:38:56.639 --> 00:38:58.980
and esteem you. But I say when you pray, go into

00:38:58.980 --> 00:39:01.079
your closet where your Father is the only one

00:39:01.079 --> 00:39:04.849
that can see you. Yes. You know, so we've made

00:39:04.849 --> 00:39:07.309
the Christian and I think we've, we've communicated

00:39:07.309 --> 00:39:09.429
kind of passively. I don't think that anybody

00:39:09.429 --> 00:39:12.590
would, would actually say, you're really, you

00:39:12.590 --> 00:39:14.409
know, you're really a super Christian when you

00:39:14.409 --> 00:39:17.030
have a book deal with destiny image, you know,

00:39:17.030 --> 00:39:21.829
and I'm not knocking destiny image or, you know,

00:39:21.829 --> 00:39:27.010
I'm just, I'm making jokes, but the, but what

00:39:27.010 --> 00:39:29.449
gets communicated to people is they start to

00:39:29.449 --> 00:39:33.150
think, oh, I want to be as spiritual as. Heidi

00:39:33.150 --> 00:39:35.590
Baker and a Bill Johnson. And those things are

00:39:35.590 --> 00:39:38.590
okay. Paul says, follow me as I follow Christ.

00:39:38.949 --> 00:39:42.869
But we need to, in that pursuit, recognize that

00:39:42.869 --> 00:39:46.230
this is not about becoming the next big speaker.

00:39:46.849 --> 00:39:51.170
The gospel is about how do I steward my time?

00:39:51.530 --> 00:39:55.150
How do I take care of the coworker that I'm interacting

00:39:55.150 --> 00:39:58.150
with? How did I steward that relationship? What

00:39:58.150 --> 00:40:01.230
did I do when I drove past the same homeless

00:40:01.230 --> 00:40:04.230
person that's begging for food money every day

00:40:04.230 --> 00:40:07.030
at the corner you know so those things actually

00:40:07.030 --> 00:40:10.849
matter more in heaven than whether or not you

00:40:10.849 --> 00:40:14.429
had an itinerant gig and and i say that as somebody

00:40:14.429 --> 00:40:16.329
it's one of my favorite things to do by the way

00:40:16.329 --> 00:40:18.809
is preaching conferences and i'm super excited

00:40:18.809 --> 00:40:22.750
to to be with you guys in may i just i love it

00:40:22.750 --> 00:40:26.389
but i also don't over emphasize it and i have

00:40:26.389 --> 00:40:29.730
to have a check in my heart a guard rails in

00:40:29.730 --> 00:40:33.079
place you know so I want to make sure that the

00:40:33.079 --> 00:40:35.940
things that I do are primarily before the Lord.

00:40:35.980 --> 00:40:39.599
And the reason I do them is because I know their

00:40:39.599 --> 00:40:42.579
eternal significance, not just in a conference

00:40:42.579 --> 00:40:44.360
setting. It's important to be faithful there

00:40:44.360 --> 00:40:47.059
too, but also when I'm at home with my wife and

00:40:47.059 --> 00:40:50.780
kids and how I steward those relationships. Very

00:40:50.780 --> 00:40:54.699
true. Everything in between. Very true. You know,

00:40:54.800 --> 00:40:56.960
you're going to meet, have you met Dean Braxton

00:40:56.960 --> 00:41:00.219
before? I haven't. Okay. So you're going to meet

00:41:00.219 --> 00:41:03.119
him at this convention. And we've had a couple

00:41:03.119 --> 00:41:05.739
of podcasts with him that covered a subject because

00:41:05.739 --> 00:41:08.880
he spent an hour and 45 minutes outside of his

00:41:08.880 --> 00:41:11.500
body. His body was dead. The medical team was

00:41:11.500 --> 00:41:13.639
working on him for an hour and 45 minutes, and

00:41:13.639 --> 00:41:15.900
he finally came back. In the meantime, he was

00:41:15.900 --> 00:41:18.659
with the Father and Jesus in heaven. And one

00:41:18.659 --> 00:41:21.900
of the things that he tells, and we'll put links

00:41:21.900 --> 00:41:24.400
to the podcast where he's talking about it in

00:41:24.400 --> 00:41:28.929
the show notes, he talks about In heaven, they

00:41:28.929 --> 00:41:32.329
communicate thought to thought rather than speaking.

00:41:33.050 --> 00:41:37.530
And everyone greets each other with, how can

00:41:37.530 --> 00:41:42.130
I serve you? And it's all about service. It's

00:41:42.130 --> 00:41:45.349
all about how can I serve you? And everything

00:41:45.349 --> 00:41:51.190
in heaven is alive and intelligent and can communicate

00:41:51.190 --> 00:41:54.590
the grass and the flowers and the rocks and the

00:41:54.590 --> 00:41:58.119
atmosphere and the mountains. trees and you know

00:41:58.119 --> 00:42:01.360
everything is alive and and communicating and

00:42:01.360 --> 00:42:05.539
he talks about how like even the plants as he

00:42:05.539 --> 00:42:08.139
arrived were welcoming him and that's how they

00:42:08.139 --> 00:42:11.360
were serving him so my whole point here is that

00:42:11.360 --> 00:42:15.840
we have so often i think in the body is in our

00:42:15.840 --> 00:42:19.539
attempt to honor and and perhaps in in the idea

00:42:19.539 --> 00:42:23.780
of idolizing that we have put such an emphasis

00:42:23.780 --> 00:42:27.909
on serving the top echelon and not the one on

00:42:27.909 --> 00:42:30.469
the street that needs help. You know, how can

00:42:30.469 --> 00:42:34.469
I serve you? How can I serve you? And, you know,

00:42:34.489 --> 00:42:38.690
I just think it's so important for us to be tuning

00:42:38.690 --> 00:42:43.429
in to the Holy Spirit and not just do stuff because

00:42:43.429 --> 00:42:47.130
you see it with your eyes in the natural realm,

00:42:47.210 --> 00:42:51.590
but that we become so tuned to the Holy Spirit

00:42:51.590 --> 00:42:55.849
that we get that nudge. to speak to this person

00:42:55.849 --> 00:42:58.829
or to do something for that person or to serve

00:42:58.829 --> 00:43:02.289
them in a way that is beyond their expectation.

00:43:02.769 --> 00:43:06.090
Like to give the cup of water to a child, like

00:43:06.090 --> 00:43:09.050
you said. Those are things that we do on earth

00:43:09.050 --> 00:43:13.010
as it is in heaven. And it's our service to one

00:43:13.010 --> 00:43:16.130
another that God is looking for in ways that

00:43:16.130 --> 00:43:20.449
we don't really grasp that in our culture so

00:43:20.449 --> 00:43:25.690
much. But that's heaven culture. Yep. That's

00:43:25.690 --> 00:43:28.329
one of the things that is so much on my heart

00:43:28.329 --> 00:43:31.650
in this podcast is that we help equip people

00:43:31.650 --> 00:43:36.610
to do on earth as it is in heaven. Amen. It's

00:43:36.610 --> 00:43:39.110
like when Jesus was washing the disciples' feet.

00:43:39.429 --> 00:43:42.789
Yes. Being a servant. Right. I'm modeling this

00:43:42.789 --> 00:43:46.389
for you. Yeah. Here's what leadership should

00:43:46.389 --> 00:43:49.690
look like. Yeah. Remember our last night in China?

00:43:49.809 --> 00:43:52.559
Oh, yeah. One of those, the pastors. Came out

00:43:52.559 --> 00:43:54.940
with this. It was cold. It was about 48 degrees.

00:43:55.179 --> 00:43:57.760
Yeah, it was cold inside. In the church. And

00:43:57.760 --> 00:44:00.820
they came out with this hot water, stuck our

00:44:00.820 --> 00:44:03.579
feet in it, and they just started working all

00:44:03.579 --> 00:44:06.900
over on our muscles, our back, and the pastor.

00:44:07.420 --> 00:44:13.059
Yeah, washing our feet and massaging tight muscles.

00:44:13.219 --> 00:44:17.539
It was amazing. Wow. But it's a culture of service.

00:44:17.679 --> 00:44:22.449
Yeah. So I think we could learn a lot. about

00:44:22.449 --> 00:44:25.150
serving and humbling ourselves to serve one another.

00:44:25.289 --> 00:44:28.349
The reason why Peter said you shouldn't wash

00:44:28.349 --> 00:44:33.090
my feet, I believe, as you look at how the disciples

00:44:33.090 --> 00:44:36.710
were seated at the table, Peter was in the position

00:44:36.710 --> 00:44:38.989
where he should have been washing everybody's

00:44:38.989 --> 00:44:41.030
feet because there wasn't a servant to do it.

00:44:41.429 --> 00:44:44.050
If there's a servant, the servant does it. But

00:44:44.050 --> 00:44:47.610
if it's the last guy at the table, that should

00:44:47.610 --> 00:44:49.710
be washing people's feet and peter didn't feel

00:44:49.710 --> 00:44:51.510
like washing everybody's feet so he didn't and

00:44:51.510 --> 00:44:55.769
that's why jesus did it it's it's about learning

00:44:55.769 --> 00:44:58.929
to humble ourselves and serve one another in

00:44:58.929 --> 00:45:01.550
in ways that you know the world doesn't teach

00:45:01.550 --> 00:45:06.230
this right and you know i don't know about y

00:45:06.230 --> 00:45:08.449
'all but i'm i'm sure you've seen this too the

00:45:08.449 --> 00:45:10.289
place i see it the most is on the mission field

00:45:10.289 --> 00:45:15.699
you know when when you're in impoverished third

00:45:15.699 --> 00:45:19.400
world countries where being a leader is at your

00:45:19.400 --> 00:45:22.440
expense. It's pouring out of yourself. It's a

00:45:22.440 --> 00:45:25.760
service. That's where you get to see it really

00:45:25.760 --> 00:45:29.300
walked out. And for me, that's, well, one, that's

00:45:29.300 --> 00:45:33.099
where I come alive. I love missions. I know that

00:45:33.099 --> 00:45:34.940
I belong on the mission field. The most fulfilled

00:45:34.940 --> 00:45:40.599
I feel is when I'm out there. and eating awful

00:45:40.599 --> 00:45:46.519
things, but enjoying people that just love the

00:45:46.519 --> 00:45:51.000
Lord. And it's really maybe selfish isn't the

00:45:51.000 --> 00:45:54.280
right word, but I feel like when I come back

00:45:54.280 --> 00:45:57.099
from mission trips, I receive way more than I

00:45:57.099 --> 00:46:00.239
give. Yes, it's beautiful. And just experiencing

00:46:00.239 --> 00:46:04.869
the body in that way. Yes. And I'm hoping that

00:46:04.869 --> 00:46:07.489
we will have a good representation of people

00:46:07.489 --> 00:46:10.210
from many nations coming to this convention.

00:46:10.809 --> 00:46:13.809
I hope they'll be able to get visas to come and

00:46:13.809 --> 00:46:19.590
enjoy being together again like we have in years

00:46:19.590 --> 00:46:23.150
past. But these last few years have been difficult

00:46:23.150 --> 00:46:26.929
in terms of getting visas and so on. So we hope

00:46:26.929 --> 00:46:30.000
they have success this year. and that you'll

00:46:30.000 --> 00:46:32.559
get to meet some people from other nations that

00:46:32.559 --> 00:46:34.199
you haven't been to yet. I know you've been to

00:46:34.199 --> 00:46:37.880
several nations, and I love what God is doing

00:46:37.880 --> 00:46:42.019
in your life, opening doors to new nations. So

00:46:42.019 --> 00:46:46.099
before we close, would you pray for our listeners,

00:46:46.380 --> 00:46:50.440
just as the Holy Spirit leads? Sure. Heavenly

00:46:50.440 --> 00:46:56.699
Father, we thank you for the example that you

00:46:56.699 --> 00:47:00.219
gave us in Jesus. Yes, Father. Or the example

00:47:00.219 --> 00:47:04.300
of humility, of going low. Yes. Father, for those

00:47:04.300 --> 00:47:09.599
that are confused by exposure, by things that

00:47:09.599 --> 00:47:12.940
they've put their heart in, that ministries that

00:47:12.940 --> 00:47:14.920
they've put their trust in, that have let them

00:47:14.920 --> 00:47:17.840
down, Father, I pray that you would connect them

00:47:17.840 --> 00:47:21.559
to pastors, to leaders, to those that can encourage

00:47:21.559 --> 00:47:24.739
them in their walk and their destiny. Lord, let

00:47:24.739 --> 00:47:27.679
the real things that they experienced of you

00:47:27.679 --> 00:47:31.500
in those places, let those remain and let everything

00:47:31.500 --> 00:47:33.599
else that can be shaken, Lord, let it just fall

00:47:33.599 --> 00:47:36.960
to the floor. Yes. Yes, Father. Father, bring

00:47:36.960 --> 00:47:40.079
us back to this place of authentic Christianity.

00:47:40.679 --> 00:47:44.400
Yes, Lord. Forgive us for every way that we have

00:47:44.400 --> 00:47:48.780
idolized people, where we have overlooked the

00:47:48.780 --> 00:47:52.159
downtrodden. God, give us hearts. Like yours,

00:47:52.320 --> 00:47:54.480
Jesus. Lord, give us hearts to be near to the

00:47:54.480 --> 00:47:58.780
brokenhearted, to go low. Father, I pray that

00:47:58.780 --> 00:48:01.920
you would restore compassion to the body. Yes,

00:48:01.920 --> 00:48:05.659
Lord. Thank you, Father. And Lord, we thank you

00:48:05.659 --> 00:48:08.179
for what you're doing. We thank you for the move

00:48:08.179 --> 00:48:10.139
of the Spirit that we're seeing in high schools

00:48:10.139 --> 00:48:12.840
and college campuses. God, I pray that you would

00:48:12.840 --> 00:48:15.800
continue them, that you would increase it. Yes.

00:48:15.880 --> 00:48:18.630
Thank you, Father. Lord, let this be the time

00:48:18.630 --> 00:48:21.309
for a nameless and faceless generation to rise

00:48:21.309 --> 00:48:26.530
up. Yes. Lord, that a move of the Spirit would

00:48:26.530 --> 00:48:29.690
be released in our nation. Yes. Father, I pray

00:48:29.690 --> 00:48:31.929
for the Spirit of Elijah to come, to restore

00:48:31.929 --> 00:48:34.449
the hearts of fathers to sons and sons to fathers.

00:48:34.650 --> 00:48:38.010
Yes, Father. Restore relationship. Lord, I pray

00:48:38.010 --> 00:48:40.389
that Christianity would look like relationship

00:48:40.389 --> 00:48:43.469
again. Yes. Relationship with you and relationship

00:48:43.469 --> 00:48:46.460
with each other. Lord, we bless your name. And

00:48:46.460 --> 00:48:49.860
we magnify you. I pray in Jesus' name. Amen.

00:48:49.980 --> 00:49:14.849
Amen. Check out our website at globaloutpouring

00:49:14.849 --> 00:49:18.150
.org to find out more information, read our blogs,

00:49:18.289 --> 00:49:21.110
connect with us, and donate. You can also browse

00:49:21.110 --> 00:49:23.710
our web store for life -changing anointed books.

00:49:24.130 --> 00:49:27.530
Until next time, this is Sharon Buss. And I'm

00:49:27.530 --> 00:49:30.250
Philip Buss. God bless you with His overwhelming,

00:49:30.429 --> 00:49:31.429
loving presence.