Jews and Christians Learning to Relate: Rabbi Leonid Feldman’s Story

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Well, welcome back to the Out of Zion podcast and this week's segment on Jews and Christians

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learning to relate when we are going to hear a fascinating story from another pioneer in

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this brand new relationship.

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So please stick with me.

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Welcome to the Israel answers series connecting Israel, the Bible and you.

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And Susan Michael, as she explores timely issues and current events from a scriptural

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perspective to equip the Christian world with a balance and biblical response.

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Be sure to subscribe for future episodes, which will ignite your faith and bring the

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Bible to life in your everyday world.

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Now let's join Susan with your Israel answers.

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So this week we have with us just a fascinating guest and a dear friend Rabbi Leonid Feldman.

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He came originally from the former Soviet Union, has a fascinating story to tell, but

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has been involved in Jewish-Christian relations for really the last, I'd say almost 40 years.

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He can clarify that and has really had a number of experiences that we can learn from.

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He'll have wonderful advice for us.

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And so I want to give a very warm welcome to Rabbi Feldman.

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Thank you very much.

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It's a pleasure to be here.

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It's a real honor to have you with us today and to hear from your story and from your

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experience.

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You are right now serving as the Rabbi at the Temple Bethel.

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Temple Bethel, thank you.

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You're in West Palm Beach and it's a conservative synagogue.

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And you were the first Rabbi of a conservative synagogue from the former Soviet Union here

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in America.

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You have many other firsts and many wonderful credentials and I will say that you have advanced

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degrees.

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Your PhD is in international relations, which I found to be fascinating.

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So there's so much we look forward to hearing from you.

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Please share with us just a little bit about your upbringing, your background in the former

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Soviet Union and what that means to your life story.

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Okay, so first I think I should begin with a dramatic changes, emotional changes happening

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in my life right now.

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I am actually retiring after 34 years of being a pulpit rabbi at the end of July.

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And if that was not enough, which is a bittersweet, a lot of memories and reminiscences, but if

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that was not enough, a month later, I am actually making aliyah.

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I am going.

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Congratulations, Mazel Tov.

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So my daughter made aliyah a year ago and she's very happy.

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She lives in Tel Aviv and I have been dreaming about this for many years and I waited for

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my children to grow up.

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So I now am ready to go.

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And of course it's not easy.

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I've been in this congregation for many years and people are depressed and emotional and

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so on.

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Anyway, let's go back to what you asked about.

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I do have a strange background.

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I grew up in a city of Kishiniv, which is the capital of a country now called Moldova.

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It used to be one of the 15 republics in the Soviet Union.

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And I grew up the typical Soviet child.

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Never heard about Jesus, never heard about Passover, never heard about Hanukkah, never

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heard about God.

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I was an atheist and in fact later on I went to university and I studied physics and as

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a physics teacher I was supposed to also learn and teach a subject called scientific

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atheism.

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It was my job basically to prove to Soviet children that there is no God, there cannot

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be a God and only mentally sick people believe in God.

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So that's a very strange background for Arabi.

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And you mentioned that I am the first conservative Arabi in America from the Soviet Union.

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Unfortunately I'm still the only one.

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And that's very sad to me.

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But the reason is obvious.

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They ruined us.

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For 75 years the propaganda, anti-God, anti-religion propaganda, the atheistic real brainwashing,

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brainwashed millions of us.

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And I'm still trying to find somebody and I hope to find somebody in Israel.

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That's basically what I'm planning to do.

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I'm still not going to be on the beach until I've, I hope to be able to teach Russian Jews,

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Ukrainian Jews, we just heard this week, 30,000 Ukrainian Jews just landed in Israel.

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And most of them don't know much about Judaism.

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Some of them know nothing about Judaism.

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And some of them have been actually turned off by the ultra-Orthodox establishment in

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Israel.

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So I'm hoping that I can still actually influence the Israeli society.

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So anyway, so that's my background.

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And I came to Israel first.

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I was a refugee.

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I was a dissident for my immigration.

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Now, explain to our audience what that means that you were a refusenig.

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It means you were imprisoned.

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I was imprisoned for a short time after my hunger strike, but you're correct.

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And I have a podcast now called Ask the Rabbi.

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And I devoted once one episode, I think it's number three, basically trying to explain to

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Americans what does it mean to emigrate from a perfect society?

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We were always told this is workers' paradise.

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It's the best country in the world.

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Every morning of my life, I said, death to American imperialism, Israeli Zionism.

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We live in the most perfect society on earth.

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The future of humanity, glorious communism.

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Lenin was, Lenin is, Lenin will be forever.

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And suddenly somebody stands up and says, I don't like it here.

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I want to go.

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Of course, it's against everything, their ideology, their philosophy, their educational

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system.

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So nobody ever even dreamed about leaving that country.

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It's a betrayal.

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But we found a way, Jews, we said, you know what?

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Ukrainians have a republic, Ukraine.

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Lithuanians have Lithuania.

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Kazakh people, they have Kazakhstan.

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Moldavians have Moldavia.

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But Jews are homeless.

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We don't have a place here.

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And yet there is a country called Israel.

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And this is how we began this movement.

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And we, of course, were very threatening to the society, to the system, and they wanted

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to suppress it as much as possible.

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So even when we went through 35 stages, steps of trying to apply for emigration, which the

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word itself is weird in the Russian language, nobody emigrated there from there back in

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so many years.

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So even when we finally applied, some of us were refused the exit visa.

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Most Americans don't understand this concept.

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Every American can get on a plane right now, today, and fly to Tokyo, or to Australia,

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or to Africa.

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And the White House is not going to question them.

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Nobody is going to stop them.

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Why are you going to Australia?

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In the Soviet Union, nobody ever leaves the country, unless you're party official and

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famous athletes and so on and so forth.

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So anyway, they refused some of us.

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And we become, that's the new word, refused nicks.

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And then when you become a refused nick, you have two choices.

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Either they tell you, if you sit quiet, get a job as an elevator man, maybe.

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With three PhDs, you lose everything, obviously.

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You can get a job as an in-construction or something.

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They say if you sit quietly, maybe a year from now, you can reapply.

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And we will consider your application, which means some people have done it.

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If you have a wife and three children or two children, you have a lot to lose because they

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can rape your wife and so on.

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So many people, older people, have chosen that path.

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I was single.

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I was young.

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I said I have nothing to lose.

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I hate this country so much.

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I'm willing to try everything.

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And you become aggressive.

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You become active.

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You sign petitions.

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You try to meet with American tourists and so on.

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And eventually nothing worked.

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And I went on a hunger strike basically saying I'd rather die than live in this country.

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And hunger strike.

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And this was what year?

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This is 1976.

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I was 23 years old.

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And hunger strike is a very, very powerful and threatening tool.

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That's the only tool, only weapon that we have against them because if people, if peasants

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in Nicaragua or in Venezuela will find out that there are people in a communist society

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are so desperate that they want to die, wow, maybe communism is not such a great system.

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Maybe something is wrong there.

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And this is what I'm trying to use my podcast for.

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I'm very, very worried about America.

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I'm worried about where we're moving, what direction we're taking.

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And I'm worried about the young people today who are attracted to Bernie Sanders and AOC

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who are destroying this country that I love so much.

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They are literally destroying this country.

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And unfortunately young people don't know anything about communism.

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They don't know anything about totalitarian regimes.

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And they say, hey, if education is going to be free, everything will be free.

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Why not?

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So is that best?

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That's my story.

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Well we will link to your podcast for anyone that wants to go and listen to more of your

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story and the things that you're talking about, which I would really recommend they do that.

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But let's finish your story.

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You ended up then in Israel first?

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Correct.

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I came to Israel.

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I spent three years in Jerusalem.

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I was very naive.

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And I have one episode.

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I called it Walking on the Moon.

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It's literally my first visit to the supermarket.

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People meet me all over the country and say, I will never forget your story about the supermarket.

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People who, you know, I used to give lectures all over the country.

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It's again, for every American who is complaining about America, we just discovered that only

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38% of Americans are proud to be Americans.

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This is still the greatest country in the world.

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And I described my first visit to the supermarket where I walked in, I opened my mouth, and

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I was frozen.

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I thought it was the most gorgeous museum I have ever seen in my life.

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And I spent three hours totally confused about all these varieties and so on.

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Anyway, I spent three years in Jerusalem.

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I went to the army.

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I went to, I got a master's degree on my own, Scopus at Hebrew University.

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And then I was, I got an amazing job.

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I was sent to Italy to work with Russian refugees who left the Soviet Union, but chose not to

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come to Israel.

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They chose to come go to America or Canada or Australia.

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And my job was not to convince them to come to Israel.

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My job was to prepare them for the free world.

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After three years in Israel, I knew what a bank was, I knew what a microwave was, I knew

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what the odorant was, I knew what toilet paper was.

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You see, this is another thing that Americans do not understand.

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It was a third world country, third world country with atom bombs.

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That's it.

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It was a primitive society, worse than most African countries.

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So I had to teach these refugees basic things.

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What's a checking book?

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What's a bank?

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What's insurance?

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What's real estate and so on.

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And I was also teaching Judaism and Zionism in particular.

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I was not religious, but I was a Zionist, clearly.

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So I was trying to teach them a little bit about Jewish history, Zionism and so on.

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And then I came to America to get a PhD at Columbia University because I had met a famous

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professor in Jerusalem.

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And I couldn't afford to go to Columbia University.

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They asked me if I had $67,000 a year to become a foreign student.

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And I never heard about that kind of money.

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I had, after three years in Israel, I thought I was rich.

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I had close to $4,000 in savings.

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And suddenly they said, no, we cannot give you a visa as a student unless you show that

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you have enough money.

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That leads me to another crazy story.

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I went to a lawyer, a immigration lawyer, said, how can I get a green card so I can

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work?

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And she said, well, you have to work in a house.

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It's called domestic field.

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And so I became a butler.

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So my first job in the free world, in America, I became a butler in Westchester, New York.

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So with two master's degrees, I learned how to serve four cups and four glasses and four

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forks and four knives.

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And I used to wear a uniform and I used to say, breakfast is served, ma'am.

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Anyway, that was my job.

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Well, you have to draw the connection for us now.

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How did you become religious and become a rabbi?

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So this is it.

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I had one address, one American that I had met in Israel and I decided to write to him.

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Maybe he remembers me and he says, this is ridiculous.

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He responded to me.

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He says, this is ridiculous.

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You should not be a butler.

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You have gifts.

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You have talents.

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Send me your resume.

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You should come to.

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And he was in Los Angeles.

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Anyway, so he showed my resume to a few people and I got four different jobs.

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I was making $200 and one Hebrew school and $300 at the Jewish Federation.

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And it was very basic.

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Anyway, and then when I was just applying for these four jobs, two of the people, principles

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of the Hebrew schools asked me a strange question.

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Do you know Dennis Prager or Joseph Talushkin?

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Do you know those names?

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And I said, no, I just arrived in America and they said, you should meet them.

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You have a lot in common.

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I think you will enjoy meeting each other.

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Anyway, so somebody introduced us and that changed my life.

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Dennis Prager and Joseph Talushkin became my close friends until today.

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And I read a book that they wrote at the age of 26, the nine questions people ask about

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Judaism.

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It changed my life.

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And six months later, I was already a student in the rabbinical program at the Jewish Theological

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Seminary where I eventually was ordained six years later.

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That's my story.

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Well, it's fascinating.

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00:16:13,600 --> 00:16:16,240
And there's one more aspect to this.

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If I remember right, you did not have your bar mitzvah until later in life.

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Is that right?

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00:16:24,120 --> 00:16:25,120
It is correct.

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Nobody had a bar mitzvah, but mitzvah in the Soviet Union.

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I never heard about bar mitzvah.

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I never knew that there are people called rabbis.

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I did not know there were synagogues.

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Again, this is something that Americans cannot understand.

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The average Christian, the average Christian, I'm not talking about people like you.

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00:16:42,080 --> 00:16:44,480
You're very knowledgeable about Judaism.

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The average Christian knows much more about Judaism and Jewish history than I knew as

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a physics teacher at the age of 23.

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Anyway, so of course I'd never had a bar mitzvah.

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And I became a rabbi.

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And usually you have a bar mitzvah, then you become a rabbi.

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But at some point in this synagogue where I'm still for another month, another three

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weeks, Temple Bethel, the two co-presidents approached me and said, we understand you

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00:17:10,040 --> 00:17:11,040
never had a bar mitzvah.

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We would like to give you a real bar mitzvah, not a fake one, not a kind of bar mitzvah.

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A real bar mitzvah, we will invite your family, your friends from all over and you will have

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your bar mitzvah.

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So at the age of 60, I had a bar mitzvah.

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We had 500 people there from all over the world, including my sister.

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My children were sitting there.

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My former wife was sitting there.

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I was divorced by that time.

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Anyway, which people still can watch my speech on YouTube.

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It's the rabbi Felbens bar mitzvah.

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And the funniest line people find in that speech is when I said, well, this is not a

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typical bar mitzvah.

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I mean, how many of you have been to a bar mitzvah where an ex-wife is sitting there?

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She loved that.

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She loved it.

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We're still good friends, of course.

293
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So anyway, so yeah, it was quite an interesting event.

294
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Such an amazing story.

295
00:18:13,320 --> 00:18:19,960
And now I realize that you had just become a rabbi and probably just come to Florida

296
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when immediately you started to engage in Jewish Christian relations.

297
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Correct.

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Is that right?

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00:18:26,320 --> 00:18:31,440
So I arrived in Florida a year after I was ordained.

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And for that year, before I arrived here, I was lecturing and I was teaching for two

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separate Jewish organizations.

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So I was all over the country.

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Literally, that's how I made a living.

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And I guess some people heard me speak and followed my career and so on.

305
00:18:50,080 --> 00:18:55,600
So when I arrived in Florida, somebody came to the temple.

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Originally, I was a temple Emmanuel on the island of Palm Beach.

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And somebody came over to me, a Christian person, and said, you know, I saw you on the

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television and something and somehow this began the connection.

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00:19:11,040 --> 00:19:18,280
So I was invited to speak in a church and and then another church and then eventually

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00:19:18,280 --> 00:19:21,480
a very important person, Faye Hardin.

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I'm sure you know her.

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Faye Hardin started a television program here in West Palm Beach.

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She came to my temple one day and she says, I'd like to interview you on my show.

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I have something like 150, 200,000 people watching it every week.

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And so so the question I think that a lot of people are wondering about is why me?

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00:19:46,160 --> 00:19:51,640
Why is it that most rabbis would never have accepted an invitation like this would not

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00:19:51,640 --> 00:19:54,440
be on a Christian television channel?

318
00:19:54,440 --> 00:20:01,000
Why was I so comfortable with Christian people and specifically evangelical Christians?

319
00:20:01,000 --> 00:20:04,760
Why was I interested in interfaith dialogue?

320
00:20:04,760 --> 00:20:07,440
And the reason I think there are several reasons.

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00:20:07,440 --> 00:20:14,560
One of them is that because I did not grow up with religion, I did not grow up with Christians.

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00:20:14,560 --> 00:20:19,280
So I did not know that somehow there is a barrier between Jews and Christians.

323
00:20:19,280 --> 00:20:23,960
So when I came at the same about racism, I never understood racism.

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00:20:23,960 --> 00:20:25,960
I still don't understand racism.

325
00:20:25,960 --> 00:20:28,420
I never saw a black person in my life.

326
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So anyway, so I never met a Christian.

327
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So I was very open to this idea.

328
00:20:34,080 --> 00:20:40,800
And then because I'm so sensitive to anti-Semitism growing up in the Soviet Union, I was beaten

329
00:20:40,800 --> 00:20:41,800
up.

330
00:20:41,800 --> 00:20:42,800
I was called names.

331
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I knew at the age of nine, I would never become a journalist.

332
00:20:46,040 --> 00:20:48,040
I would never become a principal of a high school.

333
00:20:48,040 --> 00:20:50,560
I would never become a director of a factory and so on.

334
00:20:50,560 --> 00:20:56,080
You know, as a Jew, as a Feldman, your career is very limited.

335
00:20:56,080 --> 00:21:02,400
Anyway, so when I was so sensitive to anti-Semitism, and then I discovered that there was a group

336
00:21:02,400 --> 00:21:09,880
of people who love Israel, who are always standing up for Israel, who are not anti-Zionist,

337
00:21:09,880 --> 00:21:11,600
who say the opposite.

338
00:21:11,600 --> 00:21:16,200
I looked around and I said, wow, we don't have too many friends.

339
00:21:16,200 --> 00:21:20,200
So we should reach out to the Christian, the Vangelical Christians.

340
00:21:20,200 --> 00:21:28,040
And of course, it was in the beginning very dangerous and very problematic and very controversial.

341
00:21:28,040 --> 00:21:35,680
And I began to be, also, Fay Hardin invited me for an interview for about 45 minutes or

342
00:21:35,680 --> 00:21:36,680
so.

343
00:21:36,680 --> 00:21:37,840
Then she called me back a week later.

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00:21:37,840 --> 00:21:41,720
She says, so many people called back and said, we want to bring you back.

345
00:21:41,720 --> 00:21:44,280
And eventually I basically took over the show.

346
00:21:44,280 --> 00:21:45,280
She was sitting next to me.

347
00:21:45,280 --> 00:21:48,400
She would ask a question and I would teach Torah, basically.

348
00:21:48,400 --> 00:21:52,720
I would be wearing my prayer shawl and teach stories.

349
00:21:52,720 --> 00:21:56,440
Noah and Moses and David and people loved it.

350
00:21:56,440 --> 00:22:03,120
He would run into a Jewish woman in a supermarket and she would say, excuse me, you're that

351
00:22:03,120 --> 00:22:05,360
rabbi that I saw on television.

352
00:22:05,360 --> 00:22:09,280
I was switching channels at two o'clock in the morning, couldn't fall asleep.

353
00:22:09,280 --> 00:22:10,280
And suddenly I saw you.

354
00:22:10,280 --> 00:22:11,800
I said, okay.

355
00:22:11,800 --> 00:22:14,200
And I never knew all these stories.

356
00:22:14,200 --> 00:22:16,200
I never understood Abraham.

357
00:22:16,200 --> 00:22:18,000
I never understood Rachel.

358
00:22:18,000 --> 00:22:20,720
Wow, I'm learning a lot from you.

359
00:22:20,720 --> 00:22:21,720
Anyway.

360
00:22:21,720 --> 00:22:26,600
That kind of led one thing to another one.

361
00:22:26,600 --> 00:22:33,960
I was approached by local Christian leaders and Mario Bramnik, Pastor Bramnik is a very

362
00:22:33,960 --> 00:22:34,960
dear friend.

363
00:22:34,960 --> 00:22:38,880
He invited me to speak in his church on a regular basis.

364
00:22:38,880 --> 00:22:42,600
Then I brought his congregation to my temple.

365
00:22:42,600 --> 00:22:46,960
Anyway, but at the beginning it was very controversial.

366
00:22:46,960 --> 00:22:54,440
There was a newspaper article, a Jewish newspaper article front page with my picture there,

367
00:22:54,440 --> 00:23:01,560
speaking with a cross behind me and really angry, aggressive attacking me.

368
00:23:01,560 --> 00:23:03,880
That's, you know, he's naive.

369
00:23:03,880 --> 00:23:05,360
What is Rabbi Feldman doing?

370
00:23:05,360 --> 00:23:07,680
They are dangerous people.

371
00:23:07,680 --> 00:23:13,160
They don't belong in, they don't believe in abortion and they want to convert us to Jesus

372
00:23:13,160 --> 00:23:15,000
and so on and so forth.

373
00:23:15,000 --> 00:23:18,360
That was beginning of controversy.

374
00:23:18,360 --> 00:23:21,640
And thank God I was very successful at that time.

375
00:23:21,640 --> 00:23:26,720
I was a Temple Emmanuel, which became one of the most prominent synagogues in America.

376
00:23:26,720 --> 00:23:31,280
We had five, 600 people every Friday night standing room only.

377
00:23:31,280 --> 00:23:34,920
So my board and my president was very supportive.

378
00:23:34,920 --> 00:23:36,040
They were proud.

379
00:23:36,040 --> 00:23:37,200
They did not have a problem.

380
00:23:37,200 --> 00:23:38,920
And I obviously was teaching.

381
00:23:38,920 --> 00:23:42,240
I was explaining to them, wake up, wake up.

382
00:23:42,240 --> 00:23:46,040
So what, we don't agree on everything.

383
00:23:46,040 --> 00:23:47,520
Of course we don't.

384
00:23:47,520 --> 00:23:50,160
But do you agree with your spouse on everything?

385
00:23:50,160 --> 00:23:52,640
Do you agree with your family on everything?

386
00:23:52,640 --> 00:23:53,880
So what?

387
00:23:53,880 --> 00:23:55,800
But we cannot pick and choose.

388
00:23:55,800 --> 00:24:01,520
We have wonderful people who love us, who want to embrace us, who fight for Israel.

389
00:24:01,520 --> 00:24:08,320
And slowly, slowly, more and more people quietly would come to me and say, I am with you.

390
00:24:08,320 --> 00:24:10,360
I understand what you're saying.

391
00:24:10,360 --> 00:24:16,560
And to be honest, I know, and on this channel, I'm not scared to say that, we politically

392
00:24:16,560 --> 00:24:19,040
also aligned very much.

393
00:24:19,040 --> 00:24:23,920
I suddenly realized that my people are far to the left of me.

394
00:24:23,920 --> 00:24:25,120
They don't get it.

395
00:24:25,120 --> 00:24:28,360
They don't understand the uniqueness of America.

396
00:24:28,360 --> 00:24:30,760
They don't understand how to vote.

397
00:24:30,760 --> 00:24:32,200
And they still don't.

398
00:24:32,200 --> 00:24:33,200
They still don't.

399
00:24:33,200 --> 00:24:36,200
Even three years ago, I got into trouble.

400
00:24:36,200 --> 00:24:40,320
Palm Beach Post had a frame, front page article about it.

401
00:24:40,320 --> 00:24:42,040
It had got me into trouble.

402
00:24:42,040 --> 00:24:48,320
I lost five congregants as a result, including a Supreme Court justice who was a member of

403
00:24:48,320 --> 00:24:49,320
my congregation.

404
00:24:49,320 --> 00:24:54,360
Lois Frankel, who's a US Congresswoman, did not step down because of that.

405
00:24:54,360 --> 00:24:56,440
But five other people did.

406
00:24:56,440 --> 00:24:59,560
Anyway, so unfortunately, we're not there yet.

407
00:24:59,560 --> 00:25:04,760
But more and more Jewish people are waking up and understanding that you and I have much

408
00:25:04,760 --> 00:25:10,000
more in common than the things that separate us.

409
00:25:10,000 --> 00:25:16,160
I did have one more thing with Faye Hardin, for which I'm very, very grateful to her.

410
00:25:16,160 --> 00:25:22,840
She called me up one day and she says, I want you to come with us to Africa, to Kenya, and

411
00:25:22,840 --> 00:25:32,280
you will be addressing 400, maybe 500 pastors from all over Central Africa will go to Kenya.

412
00:25:32,280 --> 00:25:37,640
And afterwards, you and I will fly with a crew to Israel because this was in the middle

413
00:25:37,640 --> 00:25:41,920
of Intifada, which I hope most of your people remember.

414
00:25:41,920 --> 00:25:47,840
It was a horrible time in Israel where almost every day there was another bus, another bus,

415
00:25:47,840 --> 00:25:52,080
another coffee shop, another pizza place exploding and so on.

416
00:25:52,080 --> 00:25:55,320
So I went to Kenya.

417
00:25:55,320 --> 00:25:58,240
I spent two days at this amazing convention.

418
00:25:58,240 --> 00:26:01,000
I saw some pastors without shoes.

419
00:26:01,000 --> 00:26:05,640
It was an amazing experience outside of Nairobi.

420
00:26:05,640 --> 00:26:11,960
And then she and I flew to Israel and we traveled all over Israel and I was interviewing people

421
00:26:11,960 --> 00:26:14,960
in Hebrew and with a crew.

422
00:26:14,960 --> 00:26:16,920
And she made a show, a movie.

423
00:26:16,920 --> 00:26:19,880
I think it was two part, maybe three part show.

424
00:26:19,880 --> 00:26:20,880
I still have it somewhere.

425
00:26:20,880 --> 00:26:22,200
I have the tape.

426
00:26:22,200 --> 00:26:27,240
And it was basically explaining to American people what Israel was going through, what

427
00:26:27,240 --> 00:26:31,960
Intifada horrendous, horrendous time.

428
00:26:31,960 --> 00:26:40,240
And people would kiss their child in the morning, not knowing if they would see them later on.

429
00:26:40,240 --> 00:26:41,240
That's what it was.

430
00:26:41,240 --> 00:26:47,560
Anyway, so eventually I lost that show and my relationship with my president was getting

431
00:26:47,560 --> 00:26:51,040
worse and worse and eventually I just left.

432
00:26:51,040 --> 00:26:57,360
Well, you've touched on so many different issues here.

433
00:26:57,360 --> 00:27:03,000
And I'll just take a minute to say that I have done a series of three articles to go

434
00:27:03,000 --> 00:27:06,760
alongside this series of interviews that I'm doing.

435
00:27:06,760 --> 00:27:11,320
And the first two articles surveyed the history of Jewish Christian relations.

436
00:27:11,320 --> 00:27:17,680
But the third one I recommend to our audience to read because I touch on some of these issues

437
00:27:17,680 --> 00:27:23,720
that Rabbi Feldman has brought up, that they are things that we have to overcome, but they

438
00:27:23,720 --> 00:27:31,800
can be overcome, but we have to be aware of them and be careful and be cautious and but

439
00:27:31,800 --> 00:27:35,200
know how to articulate on some of these things.

440
00:27:35,200 --> 00:27:39,440
And one of them today is this political divide.

441
00:27:39,440 --> 00:27:43,200
There is such an extreme division now between the right and the left.

442
00:27:43,200 --> 00:27:51,280
It used to not be so strong, but now it's so strong that it actually has the potential

443
00:27:51,280 --> 00:27:57,240
of interfering with Jewish Christian relations because most of the Jewish communities, say

444
00:27:57,240 --> 00:28:02,120
two-thirds of the Jewish community is on the left and most of the Christian communities

445
00:28:02,120 --> 00:28:03,120
on the right.

446
00:28:03,120 --> 00:28:07,760
So it is something that we have to overcome in these days.

447
00:28:07,760 --> 00:28:13,120
But Rabbi, I want to ask you, since you got involved in the 80s in Jewish Christian relations,

448
00:28:13,120 --> 00:28:18,680
and you really paid the price for being involved in it, you were attacked and you were, you

449
00:28:18,680 --> 00:28:27,120
know, maligned over it, but how have you seen it change between the 80s and between today?

450
00:28:27,120 --> 00:28:31,440
We're talking about 35 years.

451
00:28:31,440 --> 00:28:32,840
Are you hopeful?

452
00:28:32,840 --> 00:28:35,160
Am I optimistic?

453
00:28:35,160 --> 00:28:36,600
I do see differences.

454
00:28:36,600 --> 00:28:38,360
I do see changes.

455
00:28:38,360 --> 00:28:45,960
So yes, I actually suffered one of the reasons that I left that amazing congregation that

456
00:28:45,960 --> 00:28:53,880
we had Temple Emmanuel on Palm Beach is that the board has changed and the president, new

457
00:28:53,880 --> 00:29:01,440
president did not like me, did not like that I was very independent, I was very influential,

458
00:29:01,440 --> 00:29:05,360
and he basically came over to me one day and said, the board wants you to stop those TV

459
00:29:05,360 --> 00:29:06,680
shows.

460
00:29:06,680 --> 00:29:12,600
So after two years of teaching hundreds of thousands of people, Jews and Christians,

461
00:29:12,600 --> 00:29:16,320
but teaching Torah, I stopped.

462
00:29:16,320 --> 00:29:17,960
So things are changing.

463
00:29:17,960 --> 00:29:23,040
I think people are beginning to see and also anti-Semitism on campuses.

464
00:29:23,040 --> 00:29:29,200
I think also our kids are being brainwashed and they say, why is my professor saying these

465
00:29:29,200 --> 00:29:30,200
things?

466
00:29:30,200 --> 00:29:37,480
Israel is a partheid and we have Democrats on the floor of the United States Congress

467
00:29:37,480 --> 00:29:44,920
using that word, Klaib went out of her way five times, the apartheid state, the apartheid

468
00:29:44,920 --> 00:29:52,320
state before there was any investigation about the journalist from Al Jazeera.

469
00:29:52,320 --> 00:29:56,240
So our kids are going to see something is wrong here.

470
00:29:56,240 --> 00:29:59,800
And I hope that they will look around saying, who is with us?

471
00:29:59,800 --> 00:30:04,840
Well, Rabbi, our audience is mainly evangelical Christians that are listening.

472
00:30:04,840 --> 00:30:10,760
We may have a few guests that are otherwise, but what would be your advice to us?

473
00:30:10,760 --> 00:30:15,360
Some of our audience, they are not involved in Jewish-Christian relations, but they love

474
00:30:15,360 --> 00:30:20,440
the Jewish people and they'd love to be involved with their local Jewish community.

475
00:30:20,440 --> 00:30:23,360
This is something they get excited about.

476
00:30:23,360 --> 00:30:26,560
What's your advice to them?

477
00:30:26,560 --> 00:30:28,240
That's a very important question.

478
00:30:28,240 --> 00:30:33,800
My advice would be to learn, first of all, about the history of their relationship.

479
00:30:33,800 --> 00:30:35,840
When I met you, I was so impressed.

480
00:30:35,840 --> 00:30:38,760
You were so knowledgeable.

481
00:30:38,760 --> 00:30:44,800
You knew the barriers between the Jews and the Christians and that's why history is

482
00:30:44,800 --> 00:30:45,800
so important.

483
00:30:45,800 --> 00:30:51,640
That's why history for American kids, they're teaching them that America is evil.

484
00:30:51,640 --> 00:30:54,960
America is not perfect, but it's not evil.

485
00:30:54,960 --> 00:30:57,600
Which country is better than ours and so on?

486
00:30:57,600 --> 00:30:59,720
Anyway, history is the key.

487
00:30:59,720 --> 00:31:07,920
They have to understand it and major Christian leaders, including the popes, have apologized

488
00:31:07,920 --> 00:31:13,600
to the Jewish people for hundreds of years of persecution and pogroms and inquisition

489
00:31:13,600 --> 00:31:15,480
and so on and so forth.

490
00:31:15,480 --> 00:31:16,480
That's the first thing.

491
00:31:16,480 --> 00:31:22,360
They have to understand where a Jew meets an evangelical Christian, there is this obstacle,

492
00:31:22,360 --> 00:31:24,040
like fear a little bit.

493
00:31:24,040 --> 00:31:29,800
And the second thing is what I'm trying to explain in one of my podcast episodes, can

494
00:31:29,800 --> 00:31:32,480
we really trust evangelicals?

495
00:31:32,480 --> 00:31:38,600
And I explain why that you do not have an agenda.

496
00:31:38,600 --> 00:31:41,440
I mean secret agenda to convert everybody.

497
00:31:41,440 --> 00:31:45,560
In fact, if you do, I say to people, so what?

498
00:31:45,560 --> 00:31:48,360
Wake up and let them have this agenda.

499
00:31:48,360 --> 00:31:54,800
They hope that when we all make a lea move to Israel, Jesus will show up.

500
00:31:54,800 --> 00:31:57,880
Great, I will be the first one to welcome you.

501
00:31:57,880 --> 00:31:58,880
Deal.

502
00:31:58,880 --> 00:32:01,760
Why do you care?

503
00:32:01,760 --> 00:32:08,080
When your husband brings you flowers, do you say, I wonder, I wonder why?

504
00:32:08,080 --> 00:32:10,000
Do you have an agenda over there?

505
00:32:10,000 --> 00:32:12,760
Let him keep bringing flowers.

506
00:32:12,760 --> 00:32:15,440
Shut up already about the agenda and stuff.

507
00:32:15,440 --> 00:32:22,920
It's a stupidity and especially for Jews because Judaism does not really care as much

508
00:32:22,920 --> 00:32:25,960
as perhaps Christianity was in your heart.

509
00:32:25,960 --> 00:32:28,480
We say, I don't know what's in your heart.

510
00:32:28,480 --> 00:32:32,640
I want to witness, I want to watch your actions.

511
00:32:32,640 --> 00:32:39,160
How do you behave is much more important than what your motivation is.

512
00:32:39,160 --> 00:32:46,680
We will link to your episode number 20 for sure so that our listeners can listen to that

513
00:32:46,680 --> 00:32:50,440
and also sign up to subscribe to your podcast.

514
00:32:50,440 --> 00:32:52,160
I think it's fascinating.

515
00:32:52,160 --> 00:32:55,360
Will you be continuing your podcast once you go to Israel?

516
00:32:55,360 --> 00:32:56,360
Excellent.

517
00:32:56,360 --> 00:33:02,760
We want to stay in touch with you and we just wish you all the best.

518
00:33:02,760 --> 00:33:07,960
We pray God's blessings on you as you make this major transition, but such an exciting

519
00:33:07,960 --> 00:33:09,640
one to Israel.

520
00:33:09,640 --> 00:33:16,320
I know that he's going to open doors for you and use you with all of these Ukrainian refugees

521
00:33:16,320 --> 00:33:20,240
and new immigrants from Russia.

522
00:33:20,240 --> 00:33:25,960
We expect the very best, but we pray God's absolute best for you, Rabbi.

523
00:33:25,960 --> 00:33:30,680
We want to thank you for taking time to be with us today and sharing your story.

524
00:33:30,680 --> 00:33:31,680
It's fascinating.

525
00:33:31,680 --> 00:33:34,960
We've learned so much.

526
00:33:34,960 --> 00:33:42,960
With that, I want to bid everyone adieu back here next week and until then, God bless.

527
00:33:42,960 --> 00:33:45,120
God bless you, Susan.

528
00:33:45,120 --> 00:33:48,560
Thank you.

529
00:33:48,560 --> 00:33:52,440
We hope you have enjoyed this episode of Out of Zion with Susan Michael.

530
00:33:52,440 --> 00:33:58,960
Be sure to subscribe to Out of Zion now on Apple Podcasts, cpnshows.com, YouTube, or

531
00:33:58,960 --> 00:34:01,160
wherever you like to listen and learn.

532
00:34:01,160 --> 00:34:05,400
Out of Zion with Susan Michael is a production of ICEJ USA, All Rights Reserved.